I sincerely thank you for your efforts to teach me.
1. DC, I very well understand your dilemma, it is like my husband's and
of many others. I try to answer.
Dear Nina, I am sorry but the dilemma is yours and not mine. I would kindly request you to read the baalavagga of the Dhammapada.v 62, 63, 64
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N: The words citta.m and ruupa.m also occur in the suttas. Cetasikaa
I think only in the Abhidhamma. In the suttas there are many texts
on the five khandhas. Conditioned mental phenomena and physical
phenomena can be classified as five khandhas. Thus we can say: what
we take for a person is citta, cetasika and ruupa, or: what we take
for a person is five khandhas.
DC: The word 'cetasika.m' OCCURS in the Sutta Pi.taka. It only means something like 'of the mind'. Abhidhamma is not the Buddha-word. It is a late creation of puthujjanas. And theus a mere useless theory.
Now, Nina, what are the 'five khandhas'? What are the suttas you talk about? Can you please show me at least one of them, so I can understand
Conditioned mental phenomena and physical phenomena can be classified as five khandhas.
Please tell me what are the mental phenomena and physical phenomena. What do you mean by 'PHYSICAL'?
May I say again the you are using words without precise meanings.
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Most important is not to see the five khandhas as an abstract theory,
only in the book.
What is the Pali term that you are translating as 'five khandhas'? If it has anything to do with the Buddha-word, then abstract theory does not apply.
"They refer to this moment, they arise and fall away and do not belong to anyone." Can you give me a sutta reference to this statement. Or is it your statement?
Bad luck to us, we can't see them.
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"Vi~n~naa.nakkhandha is the same as citta (I can give you a sutta text
but do not wish to make my mails too long)."
THIS IS NOT TRUE, as far as Dhamma is concerned. In the Pa.ncupaadaanakkhandha analysis, we have vedanaa, sa~n~naa, sa.nkhaaraq, vi~n~naana. Usually citta refers to the whole lot. "cittena niiyati loko". Therefore, what you have written after this on this topic is adhamma.
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N: Yes, but this being never is the same for one moment. One may
believe that one sees a person, but in fact the ruupas of the body
arise because of different conditioning factors and do not last.
Ruupas are replaced by new ruupas and then it seems that a solid body
or a solid table is present all the time. We see shape and form and
the image of a 'whole', but in reality naama and ruupa arise and fall
away all the time.
Mental phenomena change all the time. There can be only one citta at
a time: then seeing, then experiencing hardness, then being annoyed
or generous, all different moments. In the sutta the Buddha says that
there is nothing that changes more quickly as citta.
N> "Yes, but this being never is the same for one moment."
Agreed.
N> 'One may believe that one sees a person, but in fact the ruupas of the body
arise because of different conditioning factors and do not last."
Difficult to understand what you are saying?
N> 'We see shape and form and the image of a 'whole', but in reality naama and ruupa arise and fall
away all the time.
To make the above statement do yo see them 'rise and fall'?
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N> It is hard to accept, we need the three rounds as
explained in the Dhammacakkappavatta na sutta.
Dear Nina, Dhammacakkappavattana sutta is the greatest and most important statement ever made about the human condition and how to overcome it. For me it is the absolute and ABSOLUTE TRUTH, there is nothing there hard to accept.
For a puthujjana, Dear Nina, the practice is 'majjhimaa pa.tipadaa', the middle path. The 'three rounds' (eva.m tipariva.t.ta.m dvaadasaakaara.m...) that you mentioned above are for Ariyans. That is how you 'understand ' (abhisambodhi) the four Ariyan truths. To get there you have to first get to sammaadi.t.thi (See MN 9).
May you get there one day.
Sukhii hotu,
D. G. D. C. Wijeratna
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