Dear Yong Peng,

I have benefitted in many ways from the contributions of the illustrious monks and
scholars who grace this website, as I have also benefitted from the discussion of
Buddha-L (though often the latter is more of an illustrious egghead coffee table and
I am more of a lurker there).

Practising monks like Ajahn Sujato and others have given us many helpful teachings.
And we have benefitted from the calmness and wisdom of such bhikkhus. We are also
informed of "cutting-edge" developments in Buddhist Studies today.

Occasionally scholars like Stephen Hodge (Pali Yahoo) and LS Cousins (Buddha-L),
amongst many others, make important remarks useful in helping us understand the
ancient Buddhist texts better. Stephen for example made many wonderful contributions
regarding the early texts in Chinese; Lance only yesterday posted an interesting
remark on the 1250 monks. Coincidentally, I have just finished working on a
translation of the Diighanakha Sutta (whose Commentary mentions the 1250).

What I am trying to say is that these illustrious monks and scholars may be inspired
to give wonderful teachings and make helpful contributions.

In a way, Pali Yahoo is like a class room and we are all students, and you are the
monitor (I am evoking the good old British school system). Some of us are a bit
naughty and impolite and personal in our remarks and think only we have the right
answers, and the monitor has to keep us in line: especially when we speak ill of the
teacher(s).

If this could be done, we will benefit from more that just learning Pali. After all
learning Pali is for the sake of knowing the Suttas better, which is for the sake of
knowing ourselves better, for the sake of awakening.

Maara is always around the corner to spoil things: let us work together and ward him
off: "Maara, I know you..."

May diamonds arise from the fires and pressure.

Sukhi

Piya

Ong Yong Peng wrote:

> Dear Ven. Kumara, Gopal, John, Nina, Piya, Robert and friends,
>
> thanks again for your replies.
>
> Bhante, the idea of removing bouncing members is because they
> superficially increase the group membership figure. Their associated
> e-mail addresses are no longer valid or inaccessible. Even those who
> join the forum through the website require a valid Yahoo! ID too.
> But, you may be referring to very unique situations which I do not
> quite understand. Hence, I will not remove any more bouncing member.
>
> Comparisons with non-Pali sources is fine as long as they are kept to
> a minimum, and more importantly they are relevant to the discussion.
>
> To Ven. Kumara, John, Nina and Piya:
>
> This mailing list is started for the purpose of learning Pali,
> especially for those deprived of proper monastic or academic support,
> and yet are interested to learn Pali to be able to read the Pali
> texts. We cannot stop people from reading or sharing any of the Pali
> texts they like. Hence, the broader scope cover the entire Pali
> literature, which is really quite enormous.
>
> Another purpose, a hidden one, is to stimulate the interest in people
> to learn Pali and read the texts. Primarily, it is to encourage
> people to learn to appreciate the suttas in Pali. Hence, this narrow
> scope of the Nikayas. This list targets the average lay Buddhist, who
> is less likely be able to read all Pali texts. So, among all texts,
> the suttas are selected for the focus. Personally, I am also
> interested in the accounts of the life of the Buddha and the stories
> of the early Sangha in the Vinaya. And, like we always do, we also
> turn to the commentarial literature and the Abhidhamma for deeper
> understanding of certain concepts and terminologies in the suttas.
>
> In actual fact, there is only one scope: This list is by Pali readers
> for Pali readers. The rest are refinements to what we currently want
> to achieve. But, I like the idea of the Nikayas as the primary focus,
> the remaining Pali texts as secondary, and anything else tertiary.
>
> As a moderator, I always like to keep the list open. I hate iron-
> handed style, and I don't think it works on a mailing list using a
> free service and relying on the knowledge and expertise of so many
> wonderful venerables, seniors and peers. There are certain things
> which I know well, and can therefore provide timely notice to the
> group. However, there are certain things I may not know very well,
> and it becomes harder for me.
>
> A good example is the recent discussion of antaraabhara. I
> acknowledge to have read about it (as a Mahayana concept), but I have
> no idea that it is an old debate topic and was once rejected by the
> Theravada. So, I was simply following through the replies and
> arguments, and hope to learn something new. For members who are
> unmoderated, I expected them to write respectfully. Unfortunately, a
> potentially good discussion ended up in unhappiness.
>
> Then, on second thought, I think I should have stopped the discussion
> if I know of the controversy, since there is no one capable of ending
> it, it would end up being a long debate of a scholarly nature, which
> will turn the list into a hotbed of scholars, but possibly lock the
> laymen out, and affect the normal Pali studies.
>
> Furthermore, I don't think we should be another Buddha-L, which
> discuss everything in detail. Certain things, while we allow them,
> should be simply touch-and-go, i.e. sketchy, sufficient to illustrate
> a simple point. We should not stretch ourselves too thin on the
> account to be open. As some have pointed out earlier, there are
> different forums for different purposes. And we should respect their
> very existence by encouraging members to participate in other forums
> too.
>
> With this, I assure everyone that the list is still as open and
> inclusive as it used to be.
>
> To everyone:
>
> For unmoderated members, I hope everyone takes some responsibility to
> the overall quality of the group. Please exhibit basic courtesy and
> avoid harsh speech. When there is an argument, whichever side you are
> on, please remain cool, objective, and open-minded. The idea of
> having unmoderated members is that I do not need to check every line
> of their messages.
>
> I apologise if there are things which I may have missed out and not
> mentioned. If it is urgent, please bring it up again. Otherwise, I
> believe there will be many opportunities to discuss them in time to
> come.
>
> There are some exciting news which I will announce over the next few
> days. So, stay tuned.
>
> Thanks again for your patience, and I wish you every success in your
> Pali studies.
>
> metta,
> Yong Peng.
>
> --- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, Nina van Gorkom wrote:
>
> It is useful to concentrate just on the Pali texts. These could be,
> apart from the Nikayas, also Abhidhamma and Commentaries. I did not
> quite understand what you said about wide scope and narrow scope
> being the Nikayas only. Perhaps I misunderstood.
>
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