Dear Ven Dhammanando,


Thanks for that clear depiction of such an important account.

> From a Vinaya point of view the earlier decision made at the
> appointed arbitrator stage was a perfectly valid one and
> thus the Vinaya-observant minority party were the ones
> preserving the Saasanaa correctly, hence the "victors".

That's an important point: the 'victors' are not necessarily the
majority, but those on the side of Dhamma-Vinaya. Leaving aside
qualms about how this event has been used to justify sectarianism,
it really is an excellent example for us on how to solve disputes in
the Sangha, alas, one that is all too rarely followed.

>
> And in another post you wrote:
>
> > But still there is no evidence that the Vajjiputakasa had
> > anything to do with the Mahasanghikas -- if they did, we
> > would expect to find the ten points of disciplinary dispute
> > accepted into the Mahasanghika Vinaya, which we do not,
> > except for the handling of coin.
>
> Do you mean that the Vajjiputtakas' ten theses are not
> explicitly stated in the Mahasa`nghika *paatimokkha*? If so,
> then this would not be surprising, for most of the ten have
> to do with how the training rules are interpreted, not with
> how they are stated, and not all of them even pertain to
> Paatimokkha rules.

This is clearly not the case with the money rules, which are stated
quite clearly and explicitly in the Vinaya (and Sutta). As per my
previous message, contra Stephen, the Mahasanghika Vinaya maintains
an identical attitude to the Theravada over money. How far this
reflects actual practice is of course a different matter.

So far, no-one has tried to answer my question: since there are
monks and nuns of all schools today who handle money; and other
monks and nuns of all schools who do not handle money, should we not
regard the ones who do not handle money as the true heirs of the
ancient Theriyas, regardless of which school they belong to?

This, incidentally, is the identical logic that the Buddha used when
deflating the pretensions of the Brahmans: who cares what caste
people come from, as long as their conduct is good?

in Dhamma

Bhante Sujato