Dear Yong Peng,

The following books on the Pali Vinaya are available openly::

The Patimokkha, ed William Pruitt & KR Norman, PTS 2001.
Ariyaseko. "The Bhikkhus' Rules: A guide for lay people", Kallista (Victoria), 1998.
Free Booklet
Brahmavamso. "Lay Guide to Monastic Rules" Free Booklet.
"The Entrance to the Vinaya" (3 vols), Mahamakut Bookstore, Bangkok.

The Sutta Discovery also often quotes from the Vinaya, and I trust you have a CD of
the SD.

As regards those who disallow the reading of their Vinaya, it is easier to understand
their situation as that of a religious business, and the "Vinaya" are trade secrets.

Sukhi

Piya
 

redxfist@... wrote:

>  
> Yong Peng,
>
> As far as I know it is completely acceptable for laity to read the  Vinaya.
> However, they are not allowed to be present during the recitation  of the
> Patimokkha and the acknowledgement of one's (monk's) faults.
>
> As far as lay people going to hell for judging monks and nuns...  I  think
> this is completely ridiculous.  It is a job of the lay people to keep  the monks
> in check.  The monks have a responsibility to the lay people as  the lay
> people have a responsibility to the monks.  It is completely  acceptable to point
> out the wrong doings of a monk or nun when they have not  conducted themselves
> in a proper manner.  Of course the lesser guidelines  should not be
> considered as serious.
>
> This is my experience and opinion, having been a  novice in a Thai  temple
> for a few years.  If any of the bhikkhus in the group can comment,  please
> excuse any mistakes I have made.
>
> David
>
> In a message dated 5/4/2005 8:56:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> yongpeng.ong@... writes:
>
> Dear  Ven. Yuttadhammo, Piya and friends,
>
> I have a question concerning  laypeople and the Vinaya. In some
> Buddhist traditions, particularly the  various Chinese traditions,
> there is a belief that laypeople should not  read the Vinaya, and
> another belief that any layperson doing so will go to  hell. I think
> the only exceptions would be non-Buddhists and scholars,  although
> that is quite a lot of people. I like to know what does the  different
> Theravada traditions (Thai, Burmese, Sinhalese, etc.) say about  this.
>
> The reason for this Chinese tradition, as I learnt from a  Mahayana
> monk, is so that laypeople will not be judgmental of monks and  nuns,
> which can also be bad karma! It makes sense?. Because of this
> [Chinese tradition], I have long regarded the Vinaya as house rules
> to  an exclusive group of people, i.e. the monks and nuns. So,
> laypeople do  not have the rights to judge about the internal affairs
> of the monastic  community. At the same time, monks and nuns cannot
> apply their "house  rules" to laypeople, since it is, afterall,
> for "internal use only". Fair  and square.
>
> Frankly, I am happy with it. I am not bothered with the  rules since I
> am not a monk. And, I have avoided the Vinaya for the above  reason.
> However, I always like to learn more about the Buddha and his  life.
> And, unfortunately, a large part of the narratives of his life
> in 'locked' in the Vinaya Pitaka. What should I do?
>
> Thank  you.
>
> metta,
> Yong Peng.
>  
>  
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
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