Thanks, Rett, for these posts from Kaccaayana.
I'm finding them fascinating and am learning a lot.

With metta, John

--- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, rett <rett@...> wrote:
> Exploring Traditional Pali Grammar 2
> Kaccaayana sutta 2
>
>
> In this next rule, Kc 2, the author presents the alphabet or
sound
> system of Pali. This is the beginning of a series of basic
> definitions needed to be able to present the rules of sandhi, or
> euphonic combination (such as ida.m ca > idañca). The next few
rules
> after this one will go on to define vowels, both long and short,
> consonants, the ".m" sound and the "vaggas" or classes of
> consonants. They are not so complicated, and it should be
possible
> to include several of them in the next installment. Interestingly,
> the explanations (vutti) of these definition-rules usually end
with a
> cross-reference to another rule where the defined term is actually
> employed. That pattern starts here, and will continue through the
> next few rules.
>
> Text, rule 2:
>
> akkharaapaadayo ekacattaaliisa /2/
>
> te ca kho akkharaa 'pi a-kaaraadayo ekacattaaliisa.m suttantesu
> sopakaaraa honti / ta.m yathaa a aa i ii u uu e o ka kha ga gha
^na
> ca cha ja jha ña .ta .tha .da .dha .na ta tha da dha na pa pha ba
> bha ma ya ra la va sa ha .la a.m ti akkharaa honti / akkhara
iccanena
> kvattho / attho akkharasaññaato //
>
> Translation:
>
> 2) The syllables, moreover, beginning with 'a' are forty-one (in
number).
>
> And those syllables, moreover, beginning with the sound 'a' are
> forty-one (in number) (and) are of assistance in the suttantas.
As
> follows:
>
> "a aa i ii u uu e o
> ka kha ga gha ^na
> ca cha ja jha ña
> .ta .tha .da .dha .na
> ta tha da dha na
> pa pha ba bha ma
> ya ra la va
> sa ha .la a.m" are the syllables.
>
> What is the purpose of "syllable"? Meaning is made intelligible
> through syllables.
>
> [end of translation]
>
> Words:
>
> a-aadi: 'a' + beginning. i.e. having 'a' as it's beginning, or
> beginning with 'a'.
> a-kaara: the sound (or letter) 'a'
> aadi: beginning, aadayo: plural of aadi
> akkhara: _syllable_, letter, sound, phoneme
> attho: purpose, meaning, sense
> kvattho: ko attho, what purpose
> iccanena: iti anena (sandhi: t+i/y before vowel optionally > cc)
> iti: 'thus' (usually appears as 'ti' in Pali)
> ekacattaaliisa, ekacattaaliisa.m: eka + cattaaliisa, one + forty,
forty-one
> ta.m yathaa: 'as follows' 'such as' (cpr. seyyathaa)
> sopakaara: sa + upakaara, having + assistance (Speaking of which
I'd
> appreciate assistance with this word, because I'm not confident
about
> how it's being used here)
> honti: (they) are
>
>
> Notes:
>
> It has been pointed out to me that instead of 'phonemes' it might
be
> better to translate 'akkhara' as syllable. I do so here, and that
> applies retroactively to sutta 1 as well. Thanks!
>
> Based on the vutti, we can expand the sutta as follows: "akkharaa
api
> a-aadayo ekacattaaliisa /2/" The 'api' has had both its vowels
elided
> in the rule. I'm not sure if 'api' fulfills a technical function
> here. I've translated non-committally as 'moreover', but there
might
> be more to it.
>
> In the translation I've arranged the consonants according to place
of
> articulation. This system is explained in detail in the chart in
> Warder's _Introduction to Pali_ on page 2. I consider this
brilliant
> scheme an example of ancient Indian science at its finest.
>
> The syllables from ka > ^na are collectively referred to as the
> ka-vagga (ka-group, or gutterals). Likewise the letters from ca >
ña
> are referred to as the ca-vagga (palatals), and so on. These terms
> will soon be defined in this first chapter of Kc. (a coming
example
> of their application is in the rule for reduplication, where roots
> beginning with consonants in the ka-vagga, reduplicate with the
> corresponding consonant in the ca-vagga).
>
> The final question appears to me to be asking, what is the purpose
of
> (definging) the word 'syllable' (akkhara). I.e. why bother
defining
> it here? The answer is a reference to sutta 1, which employs the
term
> 'syllable'. A similar formula is used in a number of the following
> suttas, and amounts to a kind of cross-referencing system. I'm
> reading with the PED as kvattho = ko attho but wonder if it might
be
> kva + attho?
>
> akkhara iccanena kvattho. Literally: "syllable" with this, what
purpose?