Dear Suan Lu Zaw,

Thank you for your remarks about the dative. As a working rule, then, it
seems to me that the most straitforward way of treating it (though not
the only one) is to use -assa where English has (to) and -aaya where
Eng. has (for). The exceptions are set out in Warder chp. 12.

Santi,

Rene

abhidhammika wrote:

>
>
> Dear Rene Salm
>
> How are you?
>
> You wrote:
>
> "I am trying to figure out the use of -assa vs. aaya (dative)."
>
> The use of (-aaya) should be noted as your quote from WARDER (p.67) :
>
> "In all declensions genitive forms are used for the dative also, but
> a special dative inflection exists alongside [the genitive] for the
> singular of masculines and neuters in -a: -aaya." He then becomes
> more specific: "The inflection -aaya has the specialized meaning of
> purpose." He gives the example: gaama.m pi.ndaaya paavisi (He entered
> the village for alms.)
>
> As for the use of (-assa) for dative, we could stick to the normal
> uses where the sense of recipient is conveyed, usually (to) in
> English.
>
> Please view the following quote from Anguttara nikaaya where the
> Buddha used both -assa form and -aaya form in the same sentence.
>
> "Liinacittassa, bhikkhave, anuppannañceva thinamiddham
> uppajjati uppannañca thinamiddham bhiyyobhaavaaya vepullaaya
> samvattatii"ti."
>
> "Monks, to the withdrawing mind, potential sloth and torpor duly
> arise, and the arising sloth and torpor are also in for increase and
> for expansion."
>
> Section 13, Ekakanipaatapaali, Anguttara Nikaaya.
>
> In the above sentence, we cannot say "Liinacittaaya". Nor can we
> say "bhiyyobhaavassa" or "vepullassa" without changing the original
> intended meanings.
>
> With regards,
>
> Suan Lu Zaw
>
> http://www.bodhiology.org
>
>
>
> --- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, Rene Salm <rsalm@...> wrote:
>
>
> Dear Abhidhammika,
> I have often wondered at the proper pronunciation of -v- in Pali. My
> Sri
> Lankan monk-tutor pronounced it also somewhat as a -w- (I would say
> midway between -v- and -w).
>
> I listened to the cassette tape to Warder (spoken by Ven. H.
> Saddhatissa). It is interesting, and he changes his pronunciation
> along
> the way! At the beginning, he says the -v- as what an American would
> call -w-. Here he is pronouncing the individual letters. On Warder p.
> 15
> all the v's are the same way. It sounds funny to my ear: puriso ewam
> wadati... dewo amanusso hoti.... ewam wadaami... But later when he is
> speaking faster (p. 307, DN 22), his v's are all as the English -v-.
>
> ---------
>
> In today's Day by Day we have a sentence with -assa (dative):
>
> 21. The merchant brings a goat by cart for the teacher.
> vaa.nijo / aaharati / aja.m / saka.tena / aacariyassa
> Vaa.nijo saka.tena aacariyassa aja.m aaharati.
>
> Yesterday we had a sentence with -aaya:
>
> 20. The doctor gives a garment to the hermit.
> vejjo / dadaati / saa.taka.m / taapasaaya
> Vejjo taapasaaya saa.taka.m dadaati.
>
> I am trying to figure out the use of -assa vs. aaya (dative).
> GEIGER (p.68) writes that -aaya is used "to express time, direction,
> and
> purpose..."
>
> This is quite broad, and would allow -aaya for both the above
> sentences.
> It does not prohibit -assa, it would seem to me. He continues: "[-
> aaya]
> is also used quite frequently as the equivalent of the infinitive...
> longing after something..."
>
> WARDER (p.67) writes: "In all declensions genitive forms are used for
> the dative also, but a special dative inflection exists alongside [the
>
> genitive] for the singular of masculines and neuters in -a: -aaya."
> He then becomes more specific: "The inflection -aaya has the
> specialized
> meaning of purpose." He gives the example: gaama.m pi.ndaaya paavisi
> (He
> entered the village for alms.)
>
> There doesn't seem to be a firm rule here. Broadly (per Geiger) -aaya
> can be used for both above sentences (but doesn't have to be?) More
> narrowly (per Warder) -aaya is used only in the top sentence:
> aacariyaaya. (But would -assa still be correct here?)
>
> The good news seems to be that one can use either ending pretty much
> at
> will for all DATIVE meanings where the noun stem ends in -a. Further
> clarifications appreciated...
>
> Rene
>
>
>
>
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