Dear Rene,
op 18-03-2003 22:51 schreef Rene Salm op rsalm@...:
Thank you for your interesting article.
I like your stressing of dynamics:
R: Here is a section from

> the Sama~n~naphala Sutta (DN 2), which depicts the recluse on his
> spiritual journey. First we have a radical reworking with become:
>
> 43. ìAnd how, O King, does the bhikkhu become perfect in morality?
> Having become one who gives up murder, Your Majesty, he recoils from the
> destruction of life.
>
> (4) Similar to point (3), in Buddhism there is nothing static. All is
> anicca. There is no atthi from moment to moment. This is another reason
> to consider become in translating bhavati.

N: It is a long development to become perfect in sila. But even though we
use the word become, the idea of, I do it, is bound to creep in. It is so
firmly engrained.

>

R: bhavoghaóthe flood of rebirth (PTS) --OR-- the flood of becoming?

> bhavaasavaóthe outflow/inflow of existence --OR-- the outflow/inflow of
> becoming?
> bhavesanaaólonging for rebirth --OR-- longing for becoming?
> bhavata.nhaaócraving for rebirth --OR-- craving for becoming? etc.

N: bhavaasava: even the anaagaamii who has no wrong view or clinging to
sense pleasures still clings to rebirth, to jhaana, to the result of
jhaana. He hopes for rebirth in higher planes. It is just how you see the
word becoming. It depends on the context what word is best. Also on how you
read it. An example of reading texts in different ways:
Last night we had the text:
... Citta.m, bhikkhave, adanta.m mahato anatthaaya
sa.mvattatiiti.
Monks, an untamed mind leads to great misery.
... Citta.m, bhikkhave, danta.m mahato atthaaya
sa.mvattatiiti.
Monks, a tamed mind leads to great well-being.
... Citta.m, bhikkhave, agutta.m mahato anatthaaya
sa.mvattatiiti.

I want to thank John for this, delightful, it is like an evening meditation,
and we learn Pali at the same time. It could not be any better.
Now this text we can read in different ways: static or dynamic. We may think
of my mind that I should try to tame. Or: we realize that everything is just
in a moment: a moment of understanding and awareness and citta is tamed. No
akusala arising. We find this throughout the Tipi.taka: being forgetful ,
unguarded or being mindful, the sense-doors guarded.
Thus, I do not mind what words are used, although we try to find the best
translation. But let us develop understanding of the dhamma, the reality
that is explained by means of a word. Words are just the means.
Thank you for your post, Rene,
with appreciation,
Nina.