Dear Venerables; Hi Group;
Dear Samatha Savaka;
(Tech note: should you be addressed as Savaka Samatha? ie are you a formal
Savaka?)
(Tech note 2: Would it be OK with your teacher to share exactly what
Buddhist tradition you are practicing right now?)
A) Soul
Perhaps this matter of soul might be best looked at the other way around? In
other words: everyone has an experience of "identity" or "soul". "Soul" is a
useful way to *view* the world in many situations and day-to-day life.
However, I personally find it easier to approach the matter "backwards". In
other words: where did this "soul" come from? This "soul that is me and
*mine*. My own private property. Finally, something I can call "stable" and
"safe" from the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune. :-)
When did it arise? How did it arise? How did it get "created"? At what point
did "I" seperate from "everything else"?
As context: I'm the guy who made up this Buddhist joke: "I".
B) Zen stuff.
Ahem. If I remember correctly, your quote about disrespect to the Buddha has
nothing to do with Buddhas or "souls". I think it relates to a student who
was getting very *conceited* because he was "seeing the Buddha" in
meditation? (Wow. The nonsense our poor teachers have to put up with ...)
First, the Buddha of our age is not the first Buddha to arise. Secondly, the
Buddha is parinibbana. According to my understanding of the teachings,
nobody is going to be "hanging out with him" or "seeing" him now.
Austin O'Malley said: "Memory is like a crazy woman that hoards colored rags
and throws away the food." It's interesting to me how the "colorful bits" of
past teachers last, achieving a "life of their own". This is also why I
prefer to always refer back to the the style and teachings of the Buddha.
*There is not one single implication of violence as ever being beneficial*
in any of the teachings of the Buddha. Not even violence in our thoughts,
much less in our words and actions. I don't think that the Buddha himself
would ever have said something that rude, violent, disrespectful to all
living beings, and unbeneficial.
Perhaps the style of the Buddha is beneficial to *all* practioners and
teachers of *all* spiritual traditions? Perhaps, since Zen teachers call
themselves Buddhists, they should consider using the Buddha as their "role
model"?
C) Some quotes - Just for fun
"Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off
your goal." - Henry Ford
"Hoping means seeing that the outcome you want is possible, and then working
for it." - Anonymous?
"Three things in human life are important: The first is to be kind. The
second is to be kind. And the third is to be kind." - Anonymous?
May all beings be well and practice well.
peace from
Andy
-----Original Message-----
From: samathasavaka [mailto:
samathasavaka@...]
Sent: Wednesday, June 12, 2002 9:09 AM
To:
Pali@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Pali] Re: Hello, i'm new to this group and would like to ask a
few questions.
--- In Pali@..., Lee Dillion <leedillion@...> wrote:
>
> So you can continue to claim all over the internet that the soul is
> beyond the aggregates, but, as noted by the Buddha, such a
claim "would
> only be speech (vag-vastu-matram), and if asked one would be unable
to
> answer, it would increase one's stupidity (sammoham apadyeta)."
The
> commentary to this sutta reads "Tassa vacavatthur ev assa. Spk: It
would
> be just mere utterance. But if one passes over the twelve sense
bases,
> one cannot point out any real phenomenon."
>
> ----
> Lee Dillion
Thanks for your reply Lee, beyond the 'all' described in your quotes,
indeed, we will never find any real phenomena. The soul is not a
phenomena.
When you see the Buddha, kill the Buddha. This means, that if you
think you have found a Soul or a Buddha or whatever, you have not
found the real "thing", why? because the real "thing" can't be found,
for this would imply that it has spacial dimensions, etc...
Thus, my questions regarding Soul still remain unanswered.
Good Day :)
Samatha Savaka.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Yahoo! Groups members can set their delivery options to daily digest or web
only.
[Homepage] http://www.tipitaka.net
[Send Message] pali@yahoogroups.com
[Mailing List] http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pali
[Discussion] http://pub45.ezboard.com/btipitakanetwork
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/