thanks for your kind answer.
SR
--- keth@... wrote:

> Hi StaveRunner!
> Well, the difficulty really is how to make a start.
> I think Gordon's advivce about the immportance of
> learning to read texts, and not focus so much on
> translation is sound. But Old Norse being a dead
> language
> is especially difficult. Also the complex morphology
>
> is a real difficulty. So I don't really have any
> good advice
> except to keep at it. Two hours each day for a
> couple of years
> would probably help. The problem is that many work
> hard for a month
> or two, and then they are exhausted and take a long
> break - too long.
> If you already knew Latin, that sure would help. But
> that's another very
> long project. And it only prepares you for working
> with that kind
> of grammar. If you already know Old Norse grammar
> real well, then
> it is much easier to learn a number of other
> grammars, such as German
> or Old English etc.. Are you English? Maybe a year
> of Old English
> would then be the right thing for you. If you know
> Old English really
> well, then Old Norse is much easier to read.
> How about going backwards in time? First read
> everything by Shakespeare
> (use 6 months), then read everything from Canterbury
> tales (another
> 6 months?) and then select older and older
> litterature, until
> you arrive at Beowulf. When you can read Beowulf
> without problem
> and also understand all the grammar, I am sure Old
> Norse (and Gordon)
> would not be so difficult any longer.
>
> But you want to have a go at Old Norse directly?
> An old trick is to choose say 30 pages and then read
> it
> over and over again until you know every word and
> every
> grammatical detail in those 30 pages. When you are
> done
> you will have reached a new level. But it is hard to
> do on one's own. Much easier in a group. I don't
> know
> if it would work on the internet. Everybody is doing
> things
> at their own pace here. Too individualistic. No
> solidarity.
> But the net is a great place to ask questions.
> Definite questions
> about definite things.
>
> Maybe the easiest thing to do would be to read
> Haukur and �skar's
> first 4 lessons and do all the excercises there.
> When you are done
> you will know a great deal more, and you will have a
> different base
> for making further decisions. Do you know where to
> download the lessons?
>
> E.V.Gordon is not really a textbook. It is much more
> of a (brief)
> reference book, combined with a reader. But the ON
> texts in it are
> quite interesting. I'd simply select one of those
> texts and read it
> slowly aloud to yourself several times to get a feel
> for it.
> Something which is also nice, is an EXACT, i.e. word
> by word
> translation of a given text. That is where people
> might actually
> do some good work: make electronic editions
> available with
> good translations that go with it. Did you see the
> text Eysteinn
> posted last month? The one about Thorsteinn
> Boejarmagn?
> It is a little mini saga, quite interesting, and
> without
> all the genealogies that usually bog down students
> of the
> more "traditional" students texts, such as the G�sla
> saga etc..
> Eysteinn also posted an English translation in
> parallell.
> That translation (by Hermann P�lsson) is good, but
> it is not
> literal enough for learning purposes. (I think) So
> that is a
> little drawback. Maybe if Arlie or someone wrote a
> more
> word by word translation, then that would be very
> useful,
> because then it could be used as basic text for the
> group.
>
>
>
>
> >Thanks for the response. I use Old Norse by E. V.
> >Gordon, 2nd edition. The pronunciation key is on
> p.
> >266. I have trouble on those lines that have
> French
> >and German words (instead of English) for the
> >pronunciation example. Edred Thorsson (aka. Dr.
> >Stephen Flowers) has some helpful stuff in his
> >FUTHARK: A HANDBOOK OF RUNE MAGIC, but even he uses
>
> Thorsson might be useful if it is correct. But I
> haven't
> seen that book. It doesn't seem like the kind of
> book
> one would choose for normal language learning.
> I think everything you need to know is already in
> Gordon.
> And the little things you need to know to get
> started there,
> are probably quite easy to learn by asking on the
> net.
>
>
> >German. I lived for a total of six years in
> Germany,
> >and took college classes in German, but never
> mastered
> >all the umlatt vowels. But at least I've heard the
> >German. I am totally clueless on what French is
> >supposed to sound like.
>
> If you had known the German vowels it would have
> been a great
> help for you. I know opera singers are good with
> vowels.
> Maybe you should contact an opera singer nearby
> where you
> live for private lessons. Ask if she can sing German
> and Italian opera.
> If she can, she can probably be of great help with
> the vowels.
> It might be a bit expensive. But maybe 5 or 6
> lessons with
> proper homework would make you an expert on vowels!
> (singing them is not a bad idea at all)
>
> >
> >Specifically, in the Grammar, part 1, section 5
> >(vowels).
>
> GOT IT !!!! (that's great. you seem to have the same
> book
> I have. Mine is 2nd edition, 1957. How about yours?)
> Page 266:
> Well there you see a list of all the vowels.
> As you see, there are 22 different vowels.
> The right column would then be the vowels by means
> of the [PHONETIC ALPHABET].
> (check that)
> Now look at the 3 last ones. They are [9u], [3i] and
> [3y].
> (can't do it much different. The 3 should have been
> mirror-reversed,
> and the 9 without the upper curl)
> Now these 3 are DIPHTONGS becayse they are
> represented by TWO phonetic
> symbols in sequence. But the first 19 are normal
> vowels. Not diphtongs
> but monophtongs. (if you are uncertain about such
> technical terms, try
> looking them up in Webster's Collegiate Dictionary.
> This is just a suggestion,
> since I don't know how much you know)
>
> Now note another thing: Among the 19 monophtongs
> there are 9 that end with
> a colon. They are [a:], [e:], [�:] etc..
> These are the LONG vowels.
> The two dots or colon, means that it is a long sound
> (=drawn out in time).
> The other ones, the 10 that don't have the colon
> inside the square barckets
> are the normal, or SHORT vowels. They are [a], [e],
> [3], etc..
> (see the table now)
> The simple rule now is that once you know how to
> pronounce
> a short vowel, you automatically know how to
> pronounce the long one.
> Thus, if you can pronounce [a], then you can also
> pronounce [a:].
> It's as simple as that.
> Now for the short "a" (=[a]), they've used the
> German

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