Re: fortis , f- >>

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "dgkilday57" <dgkilday57@...> wrote:

>
> On second thought, if <Ro:ma> is derived from *reuH- 'to spread out,
> make room' (as in Lat. <ru:s> 'countryside' from *rewHos 'expanse,
> spread', Gmc. *ru:maz 'space, room' from *ruH-mo- 'extended, spread

out,

> etc.), it is better to explain the morphology without going outside
> standard Latin.
>
> A plausible parallel is Lat. <po:mum> 'fruit', for which Umb.
> <Puemune> dat. sg. 'to Pomonus' requires an Italic stem *powemo-
> 'fruitful'. This can be taken as containing the /o/-grade of the root
> *peu- 'to propagate one's kind, procreate' whose zero-grade

implemental

> noun *putlo- 'implement of procreation, offspring, son' is reflected

as

> Skt. <putra->, Osc. acc. sg. <puklum>.
>
> Formed like *powemo-, Itc. *row(H)emo- 'expansive, broad' would apply
> to the wide part of a river where fording is feasible, and <Ro:ma>

would

> simply be the fem. sg. of this adjective.
>
> > One question: is the Tiber fordable in Rome? Otherwise, I'd prefer

the

> > classsical etymology from Oscan *sru:ma 'river', through an Etruscan
> > intermediate.
>
> First, since Oscan had *-fr- from medial *-sr- (Neap. <Ottufre>

'October'), it probably had initial *fr- from *sr- as well, like Latin
<fri:gus> 'coldness',

>

That's right. This would mean *sru:ma is either from a different
language, possibly Italoid (i.e. your Illyro-Lusitanian), or from early
Sabellian before the change sr- > fr-.

> and Etruscan allows fr-.
>

In the hapax frontac, whose /o/ is clearly non-Etruscan.

> But even if Oscan retained *sr-, Etruscan allows that as well, with

<sren> 'image' vel sim., <srenchva> 'set of images' vel sim.

>

That's also right, although in the case of Etruscan, this and other
groups arose from vocal syncope. My guess is that Latin Ro:ma is a
borrowing from *Ru:ma in an o-less language like Etruscan (although
Italoid had no /o/, according to Villar).

> Finally, Rome is not a river,
>

But it's on a river whose name is from Etruscan, BTW.

> but a city at a ford on a river.
>

Unfortunately, your etymology doesn't point to 'ford' bur rather to
'plain' or 'countryside'. IMHO, a native Latin etymology of Rome is
extremely unlikely.