From: stlatos
Message: 70345
Date: 2012-10-30
>The most common change involves Latin gn (pronounced Nn), after gn- > n-, with Nn > NYn > nYn > nYnY > ññ . A form of Romance either had all Ng > NYg (later > Ng) too, with borrowing into Bq at the right time, or Bq was influenced by, but not exactly like, a neighboring Romance for this rule. It's the common spread of Y in Romance (ie, Spanish kt > kYt > kYtY > ytY > ycY (factum > hecho)) that indicates the change Ng > ndd resulted first from pal. of N, very common there; otherwise there's no rule in either with no good expl. of g > gY etc. by itself.
> I fail to see a palatalized result of /n/ in onddo (sorry) and don't
> understand the formulation "in Western Romance, the phoneme N changed
> into NY > nY > ñ": it would require at least a phonotactic restriction
> (to intervocalic position?) and a heavy diatopic reduction (the most
> widespread result is rather a velarization)
>
> 2012/10/29, stlatos <sean@...>:
> >
> >
> > --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "dgkilday57" <dgkilday57@> wrote:
> >>
> >
> >
> >> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Tavi" <oalexandre@> wrote:
> >> >
> >
> >> > >
> >> > This is very unlikely. Spanish pollo gives Basque oilo just as Romance
> >> > fongo gives onddo (with expressive palatalization).
> >>
> >> I rejected that etymology before, and believers in "expressive
> >> palatalization" need to explain why a mushroom would produce such a demand
> >> for expressivity in speakers that only palatalization could satisfy it.
> >> Are we talking about a MAGIC mushroom?
> >>
> >
> >
> > In Western Romance, the phoneme N changed into NY > nY > ñ . Since N was
> > not a phoneme before k/g (but only classified as C+nasal, automatically
> > acquiring the place of the following stop), it didn't change. However, in
> > Bq, nasals weren't automatically given the place of the following stop.
> > Therefore, Ng > nYg > nYgY > etc.
> >
> >
> > The existence of clusters like mX is seen in:
> >
> > * XasYEmXálXi >
> > Acenari = (name), azebari / azegari / azeri / azari Biz = fox Bq;
> >