Re: Basque mendi 'mountain'

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Tavi" <oalexandre@...> wrote:

> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Brian M. Scott" <bm.brian@>
> wrote:

>>> I'm afraid Latin isn't the only source of p- > Goidelic
>>> *kW-. For example, Middle Irish céite 'hill, eminence,
>>> open space, assembly' < Goidelic *kWantjo- 'hill', which
>>> corresponds to the substrate root *pant- I mentioned
>>> before.

>> It's from PCelt. *kwantyo- 'flat hill', with normal
>> developments in Goidelic and Brittonic. A substrate root in
>> *p- is most unlikely.

> Unfortunately, the Brythonic forms quoted by Matasovic mean
> 'valley'.

No, the Middle Welsh does. The OBret., if correct, is 'imminet',
i.e., 'projects, sticks out'.

> So he conflates 'hill' and 'valley' into 'flat hill'.

The Irish word means both 'hill' and 'open space'. It can mean
'racecourse', 'assembly', 'meeting place in general', 'square',
'market place'. If at some point the emphasis in Insular Celtic
came to be on the use as a place of assembly rather then the
elevation, a shift to 'valley' would not be all that remarkable.

> Incredible!

Rather less so than some of your stretches.

>>> Also interesting is Old Irish imm-cella 'surrounds', from
>>> Goidelic *kWal-na 'to go around', a doublet of Celtic
>>> *Fal-na 'to approach, to drive' (Old Irish ad-ella).

>> No, *kWelh1- and *pelh2- are clearly different.

> Only in the traditional model. But macro-comparativists such
> as Bomhard link them.

I doubt very much that Bomhard links them at the PIE level.

Brian