Re: woad

From: Tavi
Message: 69000
Date: 2012-03-16

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "dgkilday57" <dgkilday57@...> wrote:

>
> > This Vasco-Caucasian etymology is also the source of "PIE" *gWhai-
> > <http://newstar.rinet.ru/cgi-bin/response.cgi?single=1&basename=/data/ie\
> > /piet&text_number=+400&root=config> 'light, bright', with Baltic
> > outputs such as Lithuanian gai~sa-s 'glow, redness in the sky', Latvian
> > gàiss 'air, wheather', gàis^s 'bright, clear', gaisma 'light'.
> > IMHO Latin caesius 'light blue' and caerul(e)us 'blueish' are Etruscan
> > loanwords from this root.
>
> I see no reason to dismiss the usual derivation of <caerul(e)us> from <caelum> 'sky' (also <caelus>, <cael> Enn.) by liquid dissimilation.

Yes, it's possible caerul(e)us comes from an earlier *caeluleus.

> Both <caesius> and <caelum> might be Etruscan loanwords, but from different roots. None of the IE derivations cited by de Vaan is compelling. Adolfo Zavaroni noted that Lat. <Caesius> corresponds to Etr. <Ceisna> in a bilingual epitaph. Of course, gentilicia were borrowed both ways. If the Etruscan was original, presumably there was a noun *cais (later *ceis) after which the color was named.

And this *cais corresponds to the Baltic forms I quoted above.

> There was an old Etr. praenomen <Caile> borne by one of the Vipina/Vibenna brothers, which looks like a native formation parallel to <Avile> (later <Avle>, <Aule>, borne by the other V. brother). But there is no semantic support for <Caile> as 'Elevated' or whatever, so Etr. derivation of <caelum> is purely speculative; it cannot be properly "etymologized".
>

I guess the original meaning of caelum was 'vault', although I don't have an etymology for it.