From: dgkilday57
Message: 68066
Date: 2011-09-23
>I know of no others, and Meyer-Luebke was skeptical that <alano> came from the tribal name. If it did, it might have been as etymologically inappropriate as U.S. English <turkey> for the bird. It refers to 'Dogge, Great Dane' which seems to have originated in the Nordwestblock area, not the Caucasus. Southern Basque <or-alano> is obviously a late borrowing and cannot help us.
> >This suggestion was made by Giovanni Alessio in his review (Studi
> >Etruschi 29:362-79, 1961, esp. 368-9) of Johannes Hubschmid's
> >_Mediterrane Substrate_ (Romanica Helvetica v. 70, 1960, esp. p.
> >29). Since I do not agree entirely with the relevant citations, I
> >will cite them verbatim and then provide my comments:
> >
> >"Di non facile soluzione è il problema (p. 29) dell'affinità del
> >basco <zakur'> 'Hund' col sardo <dz^áGuru> (<g^á->) 'Jagdhund',
> >corso <ghiágaru> 'Hund', <jácaru> 'Schäferhund' e, infine, col
> >georg. <dzaGli> 'Hund'. Infatti, bisogna fare i conti anche col
> >turco <zagar> 'Spürhund, Leithund' e col gr. mod. <zagári(on)>
> >'Jagdhund; kúo:n kune:getikós, ikhne:láte:s' e anche 'ánthro:pos
> >eutelé:s, tipoténios', che è ritenuto generalmente un prestito dal
> >turco.
>
> Via _zagar_: Hungarian agár ['O-ga:r] and Romanian ogar, but both
> meaning "Windhund;" "hound".
>
> Is there vocabulary pertaining to dogs, sheep, cattle & al.
> introduced in Hispania from Eastern Europe and the Caucasus region
> by Alans, Goths & al.? I've heard of Alaunts and Alanos only.
> >Il greco ant. ci offre <zágra> f., <zágrion> n., 'termine offensivo'This requires better knowledge of Corsican than I have. The areal distribution of the two Corsican words could be important also, but I have no information on it.
> >(Timostr. 4; II sec. a. Cr.), <Zagraîos>, epiteto di Dionysos,
> ><Zagreús>, figlio di Zeus e di Persephone ucciso dai Titani, e fatto
> >risuscitare da Dionysos, glossato 'megálo:s agreúo:n' (Etym. Gud.
> >227, 37), che potrebbe far pensare che <zagr-> risalga a <diagr->
> >(cfr. <ágra> 'caccia'). La forma basca e quelle sardo-corse non si
> >conciliano foneticamente
> >
> >Hubschmid makes no mention of Corsican <jácaru> beside <ghiágaru>,
> >here or in his earlier monograph _Sardische Studien_ (Rom. Helv. v.
> >41, 1953, p. 70). Probably <jácaru> was introduced to the island,
> >along with the new type of sheepdog, from a mainland Italian dialect
> >which had palatalized the *gj- but not voiced the *-k-.
>
> What kind of sheepdog? A "real" one (such as Maremmano abruzzese)?
> Or is it rather a hound?
> >No other examples have been given showing how *gjak- can yieldThen we should stay alert for possible isolates in European languages resembling the Georgian word, I suppose.
> >dzaG- in Georgian, so this connection must be regarded as highly
> >speculative. For that matter, no argument favoring direct
> >substratal relation over borrowing has been presented for this word.
>
> But some dog races came from there, esp. in the centuries
> of the "Hunic", Germanic & Alanic migrations. Esp. shepherd
> dogs that ar similar to Gampr, Kangal and Akbash/Karabash (and
> to those called in Russia and Poland ovchar(ka)).
> >The resemblance of <cerrus> to <carrasca> is most likelyThe 'pigskin' words do not present a morphological issue. While the -err-/-arr- alternation can be justified within Hispania (cf. Echeverria/Xavier/Chabarri 'Newhouse' etc.), <carrasca> appears to be derived from *karr- (according to Alessio himself 'stone, rock') with a suffix. Miguel Carrasquer once pointed out that the carrasca indeed grows on stony ground. But <cerrus> has no such suffix, so equating these words raises a serious morphological issue.
> >coincidental
>
> As coincidental as Span. Chorizo, Port. Chouriço, Catal. Xoriço in
> comparison with Romanian $oric ($orici) [So-'rik / So-'ritS] "pig's
> skin (esp. prepared, e.g. in bacon)".