From: Torsten
Message: 67064
Date: 2011-01-10
>Excellent! Here are some other forms that are not taken into cansideration:
>
>
> >LG steit, geit is what I heard. More likely seems to me an
> >origin in 'long-vowel verbs', from a kind of impersonal '4sg'
> >in -i alone, cf Greek 3sg pherei, cf Dutch draai-, gooi-, Grm
> >dreh-, NW dial gouw- "turn", "throw", later 'normalized' with
> >a 3sg -t suffix: draait, gooit. I'd venture the same origin
> >for Eng. stay.
>
> Unfortunately, in most such comparisons, only standard
> High German words are taken into consideration, and
> the dialectal variants (German dialects being the *real
> German language*, whereas the standart High German is
> an "artificial" one) are virtually unknown.
>
> E.g. instead of dreh-, many German-speakers, for example
> southerners, have drah- [dra:] ("Dreh dich um" v. "drah di um";
> "umdrehen" v. "umdrahn".)
>
> Or geh- (gehen): gehe, gehst, geht, gehen, geht, gehen. In
> various dialects there is a go- in use (e.g. "du gohscht";
> unfortunately I'm not in command of any of the relevant
> dialects where gohst, goht are typical).
>
> Even the past tense and perfect morphems -gang- has
> a different pronunciation in some dialects, even tending
> to sound -gong-. (So, again [go] instead of [ge:]. And
> this is today's, everyday's German, in vast areas of the
> contemporary spoken German).
>
> As for stehen: in Bav. there's a slight transformation
> by adding -ng- > stengen, pronounced [Stenga] or [Steng&].
> Example:
>
> "Do gibts vui, de mehra dean und des aa no bessa, ohne
> dass si vorn hi stoin! I moan, dass oa, de vorn dro stenga
> und koa Kritik vatrogn, weg ghearn!"
>
> "Translation": "Da gibt's viel (viele), die mehr tun und
> das (= dieses) auch noch besser, ohne dass sie vorn
> hinstellen! Ich meine, dass auch die, die vorn dran stehen
> und keine Kritik vertragen, weg gehören!"
> BTW, how often is there a mentioning of "dean/tean" inThat's very interesting. PIE is supposed to have to roots *dheh1- "put, place" and *doh3- "give". I've always suspected they were generalized alloforms of a single paradigm (but both actually occur also in Uralic and Kartvelian, so from where?); semantically it would not be a problem, if the verb originated in 'sacrificial technology', "to give" is not incompatible with "to put on the (sacrificial) table", and, since PIE *dh -> Gmc. *d and PIE *d -> Grm. *t (cf. also the sense "put" in German 'reintun', your examples suggest that both alloforms survived in German dialects.
> comparisons? AFAIK, only the general and High German "tun"
> is mentioned, but "dean/tean" is the "tun" uttered by at
> least 20 million German-speaking people, Munich and Vienna
> included! The same applies to "zum Doa" = "zu tun" ("to do").
> So "tun" has two "siblings": "tean" and "doa" [in both
> a diphtong: [ea] and [oa], the latter having a dominant
> [o], and the secondary <a> is tiny and often rather a
> Schwa [&]].