From: stlatos
Message: 65781
Date: 2010-02-03
>This analysis ignores all historical evidence. The god named Vindonnus is the source of *widyonos by dissimilation of n-n > 0-n (a simplified derivation is below).
> Names found in Old and Middle Welsh manuscripts often present a number of problems due to the imperfection of Welsh orthography at the time. The modern Welsh -dd-, for example (which is pronounced like -th- in "the" or "breathe") is normally written as -d-, but can sometimes be written as -t-, which can cause confusion with Modern Welsh -d- (which we normally expect to have been written -t- in older manuscripts). Another source of confusion is the Modern Welsh -f-, which normally represents a lenited -m- or -b-, but in older manuscripts can sometimes sit in for a consonantal -w- (which was written as -u- or -v- in the old manuscripts). Thus, -u-, -v- and -f- can all stand for original -b-, -m-, and consonantal -w- (which = Gaulish -u-).
>
> That having been said,
> Gwydyon uab Don (as he appears in "Math uab Mathonwy") appears in an Old Welsh genealogy as Guidgen (should = Common Celtic *Uidu-genos or *Uido-genos), father of Lou hen (=Lugus senos "Old Lugus"). If Guidgen is the original form of the name, then Gwydyon means either "born of the trees" (Welsh gwydd "trees/woods," Gaulish uidu-) or "born of vision" (Welsh gwydd "presence" from *ueid-os "sight"). John Koch (in "The Gododdin of Aneirin") believes that the -gen element ("born of")was assimilated to the Welsh divine suffix -on (Gaulish -onos/-ona) due to the influence of his matronymic Don as well as Gwydyon's brothers Amaethon and Gofannon. Unfortunately, in the same genealogical tract, there also appears the name Guitgen - which may either be an orthographic mistake for Guidgen, or may represent the Welsh version of a Common Celtic *Uitu-genos/*Uito-genos which would perhaps equate the name with Modern Welsh gwyd "passion/lust" (perhaps related to PIE words for "inspiration/fury").
>>*viyndon.o+s 'bright god, sun god'
> Aranrod/Aryanrod. It is unsure if the proper form is Aranrod or Aryanrod. Aranrod is used exclusively in Math uab Mathonwy - but may be a dialectal variance. There are examples from Gaul of names beginning with Aran- (perhaps related to PIE *Ar- [1.]which is at the root of Indic ara-h "wheel spoke," according nicely with the -rod "wheel/circle" in Aranrod). There is a submerged village off the Welsh coast called Arianrhod, which would mean "silver circle/wheel." Aranrod may take her name from a place, and not from any alleged celestial aspect of her character (there is even the possibility that her name is related to the Gaulish city Argantoratis "silver fort" where -ratis is the equivalent of Welsh -rawd/-rod from PIE *Pra- "bend").I have no doubt < 'silver wheel = moon'.
> Math should come from Celtic *Mattos (known in Gaul). Mattos would give an Irish Mat (which does appear, with the meaning of "female swine," from *matta, ultimately from PIE *Mad-da), so connections with the Irish sorcerer Mathgen are out of the question, unless Math is a Welsh borrowing from Irish. It may be that the name comes from PIE *Mazd-o "mast/staff," seeing that we have an Irish word matan meaning "small club" and that PIE -zd- gives Gaulish -tt-.It comes from Celtic *dmatYu+ 'good', which had the nom. *dmatYis. (an IE change of the final -u or -uC (maybe only -us) > -i after CY or CW (just as -i > -u after P)) and underwent analogy, usually to all forms with u/w or i/y, but in this case to *dmatYutYis. and the analogical divine name *dmatYutYin.os > Matutino[+] (just as *tewtWu+ *tewtWis. > *tewtWutWis > *teutWatWis. (with u>a which could be dissimilation after u or by CW, but is most likely a regular opt. change I will detail later) / *teutWatWin.os / *teutWan.os / *teutWin.os > Toutatis / Teutates / Toutenus / Teutanus / etc.).
> It is also possible that the name derives from PIE *Ma- "good," which gives Gaulish matus "good/auspicious," but Celtic matus itself becomes Welsh mad, and not math.
> Gilfathwy or Gilfaethwy. Once again, an uncertain name - Gilfaethwy looks like the preferrable form. The -f- can stand for a -b-, -m-, or -u-, the -aethwy from -axteios (-axt from PIE -ag-t-, -ap-t- or -abh-t) and the -i- from an original Brittonic -u-, so we may have *Gul[o]baxteios, *Gul[o]maxteios or *Gul[o]uaxteios. Perhaps the first element is related to Gaulish Gulba "peak/beak" and -aethwy from -axt (PIE -ag-t-) "works/does/leads." The -wy suffix comes from a Celtic -ei-os which is found sometimes as a patronymic.This is definitely 'child/servant of [Math]'. From a compound of *mantYtYuwiyos (or something similar, obviously a form of the name of Math above).
>>gil[]manYttwiyos
> Gofannon comes from *Gobantonos "the divine smith." I am unaware at the moment of the PIE root which gives Celtic gobant-o "smith."No, this once again ignores historic evidence. None of the ancient names related to this support such a form.