Re: Charudes - Croatians

> > This is what Gol/a,b has to say in The origins of the Slavs about
> > the origin of the etnonym of the Croatians

> > My contention is that PSl. *XUrvat- // *Xorvat- (a consonantal
> > stem!) was derived from a common noun *xUrvU // *xorvU 'armor'
> > (primarily 'horn-armor'), which should be treated as a
> > prehistorical loanword from Germc. *hurwa- // *harwa-,

We can even hypothesize that the borrowing of the Germc.

> > *hurwa- 'horn-armor' took place somewhere in the sub-Carpathian
> > region, and that its source was the PGermc. dialect of the
> > Bastarnians, who dwelt along the eastern Carpathians in the first
> > to third centuries A.D.

****GK: The Bastarnians disappear from the area some two hundred years before the arrival of the Slavs.****

> Note that this horn-armor is attributed to the Sarmatians by Ammianus Marcellinus.

***GK: The Slavs contacted Sarmatians independently. There is no reason why they should have borrowed this term from Bastarnians or any other Germanic folk. OTOH a borrowing in Avar times is historically much more plausible, esp. since Golomb's linguistic analyses are weak and unconvincing, and his historical hypothesis simply incompetent.****

>
> > Now this unknown Germanic language would have been the para-Germanic
> > Bastarnian. If true, those Croatians were in contact with
> > Germanic-speakers early. So why shouldn't they be Ariovistus'
> > Charudes?
> >
> > One thing puzzled me about the story of Ariovistus giving away free
> > land to some tribe who had done nothing to win it. Perhaps they were
> > just too lazy to work the land and let Charudes/Croatians colonize
> > the land for them, in return for their products?

****GK: As long as Golomb's silly hypothesis is around, why not try something even sillier?****

>
> Another attempt at the name:
> Wortschatz der germanischen Spracheinheit
> 'krabban m. Krebs, Krabbe.
> an. krabbi m. Krabbe;
> ags. crabba m. (engl. crab),
> nnd. krabbe.
> Dazu
> ahd. chrepaz(o), crebiz,
> mhd. krebez, krebz,
> nhd. Krebs, mnd. krevet, kreft.
> Aus krabita(n).
> Vgl. von der Nebenwurzel (s)kar(a)b
> gr. kárabos Krebs, Käfer und
> *skarabaios (lat. scarabaeus) Käfer.'
>
> If this is NWBlock, *xraBi-þ- would have been the corresponding Germanic word. Calling scale armor clad people lobsters makes sense.

****GK: Especially since there is no "Popperian" counter-proof to the intensifying downward spiral of sillinesses.****

>
>
> Torsten
>