From: andythewiros
Message: 65171
Date: 2009-10-02
>In case no one else has done so, I just wanted to comment that your idea of Gmc *hunDa- being related to Gothic <frahinþan> makes a lot of sense and is quite plausible. The connection with words meaning 'point, sting, goad, spur, pole, spear, shaft,to prick, to goad, to sting, to incite', although plausible in light of the effect of the Skt prefix pra-, I find less likely because there is little of the Gmc sense of 'capture, imprison' or 'obtain, reach'. However the Gmc meanings can easily be related to the 'hand' as that which catches or that which obtains. The *k^n.tó can then be what facilitates catching game, as opposed to chasing it. Just my two cents' worth. I think your theory may require more substantiation of the equation of Skt. pra- with Gmc fra-.
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> According to some scholars, Common Germanic *hunDa- 'dog' (st. m.) is connected with Greek <kúo:n>, Sanskrit <s'vá:>, etc., but the required derivational morphology is bizarre. To the weak stem *k^un- (acc. pl. Grk. <kúnas>, Skt. <s'únah.>) is appended the oxytone suffix *-tó, usually found in passive participles, yielding *k^untó-. Replacing the weak stem with a "zero-grade" *k^wn.-, as though the Greek and other 'dog' words were somehow derived from a "normal" root *k^wen-, does not change the Germanic result. One could equally well attach a paroxytone *-dHo- yielding *k^úndHo-, since the function of the suffix on a root already meaning 'dog' is not explained.
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> Another possibility is connection with the Gmc. verb *henþ- (st. III) found in Gothic <frahinþan>, <-hanþ>, <-hunþans> 'to capture, imprison', Swedish <hinna> 'to obtain, reach', Danish dialectal <hinne> 'id.', for which the original sense of the simplex is thought to be 'capture'. Here however we should consider the force of Goth. <fra->. With verbs of motion, the corresponding Skt. <pra-> can indicate the motion going to completion: <pad-> 'fall', <prapad-> 'fall to'; <ks.ip-> 'throw', <praks.ip-> 'throw into'; <i-> 'go', <pre-> 'go to the end, die'. This allows us to see *henþ- as the regular Gmc. reflex of PIE *k^ent- 'prick, goad, incite', whence Greek <kentéo:> 'I prick, goad, sting' (earlier *kénto:, Epic 1st aor. inf. <kénsai>), <kéntron> 'point, sting, goad, spur', <kontós> 'pike-shaft, pole'; Latvian <si:ts> 'hunting spear'; Old High German <hantag> 'pointed'; etc. The sense of *henþ- in this view is 'incite, urge into motion, chase', and of Goth. <frahinþan> 'to chase to the end', i.e. 'to catch'.
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> Now if Gmc. *hunDa- is derived from PIE *k^ent-, it cannot represent a participial *k^n.ttó-, but must continue a simple zero-grade oxytone *k^n.tó- parallel to *yugó- 'yoke' (Skt. <yugám>, Grk. <zugón>, Latin <jugum>, Gmc. *yuka-, etc.) from *yeug- 'join'. The yoke is what facilitates joining oxen, and the hound is what facilitates chasing game, flushing it out of the brush toward a spot where it can be caught or killed.
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> DGK
>