Fwd: Re: [tied] Re: That old Ariovistus scenario.

From: tgpedersen
Message: 64343
Date: 2009-07-06

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, gknysh@... wrote:
>
>
> --- On Sun, 7/5/09, tgpedersen <tgpedersen@...> wrote:
>
>
> A Snorri qoute to make you happy:
>
>
>
> http://omacl. org/Heimskringla /ynglinga. html
>
> '8. ODIN'S LAWGIVING.
>
>
>
> Odin established the same law in his land that had been in force
> in Asaland. Thus he established by law that all dead men should
> be burned, and their belongings laid with them upon the pile, and
> the ashes be cast into the sea or buried in the earth. Thus,
> said he, every one will come to Valhalla with the riches he had
> with him upon the pile; and he would also enjoy whatever he
> himself had buried in the earth. For men of consequence a mound
> should be raised to their memory, and for all other warriors who
> had been distinguished for manhood a standing stone; which custom
> remained long after Odin's time.'
>
> ie. inhumation for his own men (those of consequence), cremation
> for everyone else, like a dictator from the steppes would do, if he
> intended to stay.
>
> ****GK: Your interpretation seems to be in conflict with the
> evidence at Old Uppsala:
>
> Cf. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamla_Uppsala#Archaeology
>
> *****
>
http://omacl.org/Heimskringla/ynglinga.html
5. '...
Now when Odin heard that things were in a prosperous condition in
the land to the east beside Gylve; he went thither, and Gylve
made a peace with him, for Gylve thought he had no strength to
oppose the people of Asaland. Odin and Gylve had many tricks and
enchantments against each other; but the Asaland people had
always the superiority. Odin took up his residence at the
Maelare lake, at the place now called Old Sigtun. There he
erected a large temple, where there were sacrifices according to
the customs of the Asaland people. He appropriated to himself
the whole of that district, and called it Sigtun. To the temple
priests he gave also domains. Njord dwelt in Noatun, Frey in
Upsal, Heimdal in the Himinbergs, Thor in Thrudvang, Balder in
Breidablik; to all of them he gave good estates.'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sigtuna
[ http://runeberg.org/nfce/0245.html
http://runeberg.org/nfce/0246.html ]
http://runeberg.org/nfce/0247.html
'I ett påfvebref under 1170-talet till konung Knut
Eriksson nämnes bl. a. Fornesitune, "som biskopssätet
egde, innan det flyttades till annat ställe". Ett
Fornsigtuna (å nuv. Signesbergs egor, på andra
sidan segelleden till Uppsala) omtalas också i
jordeböckerna. Detta Fornsigtuna har antagligen före
det nuv. S:s anläggning varit en plats med religiös
och politisk betydelse. De sista årens fynd och
forskningar ha gett vid handen, att nuv. S:s ålder
går tillbaka till omkr. 1000 eller ungefär samtidigt
med Olof Skötkonungs officiella öfvergång till
kristendomen. Då Uppsala emellertid länge fortfor
att vara hedendomens medelpunkt, måste Olof söka
skaffa en ny stödpunkt för sina politisk-religiösa
nydaningsförsök. Det nyanlagda S. ser ut att ha varit
en betydande faktor härvidlag. Med sitt läge på
södersluttningen mot den vida fjärden, med sjöleder
åt tre håll och god hamn kunde det nya S. i vida
högre grad än det gamla erbjuda de långt större
utvecklingsmöjligheter för handel och religiös
samfärdsel, som de nya förhållandena kräfde'

In a papal letter in the 1170's to king Knut
Eriksson is mentioned i.a. Fornesitune, "which the
bishopric owned, before it was moved to another place".
A Fornsigtuna (on the present Signesberg properties,
on the other side of the channel into Uppsala) is
also mentioned in the land registers. This Fornsigtuna
["Old Sigtuna"] har presumably before the foundation
of the present S. been a place of religious and political
significance. The finds and investigations of the last
years have made it apparent that the present S's age
goes back to around the year 1000 or approx. at the same
time as Olof Skötkonung's official conversion to
Christianity. Since Uppsala for a long time continued
to be the center of paganism, Olof had to seek to
create a new base for his attempted political-religious
innovations. The newly founded S. seems to have been a
significant factor in this respect. With its location
on the southern slope on the wide fjord, with channels
in three directions and a good harbour the new S. could
to a much larger extent that the old offer the much larger
potential for development for trade and religious trafic
which the new conditions demanded.'



Torsten