Re: Present participle

From: tgpedersen
Message: 60866
Date: 2008-10-13

> Meillet had very short lists of words that were W IE, vs. E IE. etc.
> I don't think he labeled them as substrate but the implication was
> there as I remember.
> With all your personal archives, it would be nice for you to form
> such a list if you haven't already done so. Then we can see if they
> really are or not.
> This of course raises the questions of how to tell the difference
> between substrate/adstrate vs. innovation.

Well, there is of course Kuhn's old p- list
http://www.angelfire.com/rant/tgpedersen/KuhnText/list.html
some of which may be non-IE.
As for a list specific to west IE alone: most of the substrate words I
find I relate to a particular susbstrate, and I don't have a
particular substrate for west IE alone, except possibly Venetic. Could
you be specific as to which substrate you want the word on the list to
be from?

BTW, I'm toying with the idea the Venetic had free accent (not initial
or penultimate like the languages of N Europe now), as seen eg. some
Polish river names: Brda < *Dbra, Gwda, and that many north IE roots
of the form *C1C2VC3-, which in the present interpretation extended
roots where *C1eC2- is a PIE root and *-VC3- is an 'extension' are
actually built as a Venetic periphrastic construction, where *C1C2VC3-
is a nominal form of the PIE verb *C1eC2-. Example: English glad,
German glatt "slippery" from a ppp *gl-ádh- of *gel- "freeze". In
other words 'glad' as a crooked cognate of 'gelato'.

Pokorny seems to have gotten a similar idea:
1. ghel- (und ghel- ?), auch als i-, u- oder n-Stamm; g^hel&-:
g^hle;-, g^hlo:-: g^hl&- 'glänzen, schimmern'; als Farbadjektiv:
'gelb, grün, grau oder blau'.
Mit Rücksicht auf die häufigen Fälle, wo die idg. Palatale im
Balto-slav. durch Velare vertreten sind, möchte ich statt durch ein
Nebeneinander von g^el-, g^hel- und ghel- lieber mit Persson (Beitr.
790) und Kretschmer (Gl. 21, 115) das baltoslav. *gel- durch
Entlehnung aus einer Kentumsprache ( Ven.-Illyr. ?) erklären.
...
g^el-, g^el&-, g^le:-, (auch *gele:i-:) g^(e)l&i- 'hell, heiter
glänzen' und 'heiter sein, lächeln, lachen'.
...
1. gel(&)- 'kalt, frieren'.



Torsten