Re: Laryngo delendum est

----- Original Message -----
From: "fournet.arnaud" <fournet.arnaud@...>
To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2008 4:04 AM
Subject: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: [tied] RE: Laryngo delendum est


>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Patrick Ryan
> > > >
> > > > Chinese xu4 "raw silk, thread" < AF *sneH1-
> > > > Baxter *snjaH
> > > >
> > > > Chinese xiu4 "embroider" < AF *syewH1
> > > > Baxter *sjuwH
> > > >
> > > > Chinese xiu4 "sleeve" < AF *sluH-(bh)
> > > > Baxter *zluwH-
> > > >
> > > > PIE loanwords with H1 pharyngeal unvoiced
> > > > causing QuSheng.
> > > >
> > > > H2 causes ShangSheng.
> > > > As in AF kuH2on "dog" > quan3.
> > > > Baxter *kuHen
> > > > Cf. PAA kvHvn "dog"
> > > >
> > > > Arnaud
> > > >
> > > ==========
> > >
> > > I give what Baxter 1992 has reconstructed.
> > > I suggest better reconstruction for Proto-Chinese
> > > on the basis of what PIE is.
> > >
> > > Arnaud
> > >
> > > ===========
>
> To what does Baxter attribute the difference in outcome of ShangSheng and
> QuSheng?
>
> Patrick
>
> ***
>
> According to Haudricourt's theory
> originally based on Vietnamese
>
> ShangSheng words had a final -?-
> QuSheng words had a final -s-
>
> Baxter (and others See Yahontov in Starostin's database)
> automatically adds -?- or -s- to proto-forms.
>
> I think this automaticity is probably flawed,
> IE LWs show that
> some QuSheng are from H1 /pharyngeal unvoiced/
> It means a change in proto-Chinese :
> s > H1 > QuSheng
> some ShangSheng are from /velar voiced spirant/
>
> And H1 = -?- is falsified by Chinese.
>
> Arnaud


***

So, you are saying that QuSheng = Tone -4; and according to Baxter that
comes from final -*s.

In the case of xiu-4, 'embroider', does Baxter actually write "*sjuwH" is
the underlying form?

Or does he write <sjuws>?

Or yet: <sjuwHs>?


Patrick

***