From: fournet.arnaud
Message: 55560
Date: 2008-03-20
----- Original Message -----
From: tgpedersen
>
As for the Thuringian Przeworsk culture:
Immediately north of the new temporary Augustean Limes
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limes_Germanicus
http://www.novaroma.de/nr/provincia/karten/limes2.htm
lived the Chatti
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chatti
the target of Roman incursions
http://classics.mit.edu/Tacitus/histories.4.iv.html
Kuhn makes much of the geminated -tt- in their name and that of their
capital Mattium. PIE -tt- had become -ss- in Celtic, Italic and mostly
that, but occasionally -st- in Germanic, so the -tt- of Chatti and
Mattium must have some other origin. Traditionally it would be derived
by Kluge's law from -tn-, but Kuhn notes the alternation -ss-/-tt- in
Germanic *hatt- "hat" / Latin cassis "helmet"
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/50267
etc etc
but Kuhn also points out the Celtic Tricasses, cf. for the last
element of the name
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viducasses
(Tricastini is also found in the sources)
the Chattuari, alternatively Chasuari
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chattuarii
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chasuarii
on the last element here, vf Ripuarii, inhabitants on the Rhine
If we assume that the source of the word, whichever it was, could
alternate
*katt-/*kant-/*ka:t-/*kass-/*kans-/*ka:s-
in the style of Schrijver's language of geminates
we could include names as
Canninefates
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cananefates
Cassius Dio's name for the Chatti, Kenni ('a Celtic tribe')
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chatti
the modern name Hessen
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hesse
which, in spite of the article, can't be a straight High German
continuation of Chatti, which would give *Hetzen
nor can the names of the city of Kassel
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Dear Torsten,
I think the trouble with the words
coming from North East West South
you are putting together is
they are not obviously fitting together.
My point of view about some of the data
you have provided is :
1. Saami substrate (as sorted out by Aikio) is Baltic,
Hatt-ir is very unlikely to mean hat-highland.
2. The language of geminate is Celtic
-tt- > -ss- but -?-t- > -tt-
I suppose you hate that claim
but I won't change my mind
until you manage to propose something better.
3. we can't dismiss the risk that some *K_t words
are related for example to "hut" instead of "hand"
or may be substratal instead of being Celtic.
and have unknown meanings.
I'm only pointing at the weaknesses
of your documentation.
I have nothing better to propose.
Arnaud
============