Re: telugu and andhras

Dear all,

Most of us must have heard of the language 'pisaca'. This is the
lost predecessor of today's Telugu, which is a primary language of
South India.



I have discussed earlier in other groups some known facts of the
language, none of them linguistic.



Traditionally, it is said that Hanuman has written the first
commentary to BG in pisaca language. Hanuman, if considered to be
historical, is a Telugu person coming from Nasik, MS, India.



That Gunadhya, a poet belonging to Dhanya kataka (Andhra MS border,
India) has written a long poem in Pisaca is a historical fact. This
poem has been translated by ksemendra of Kashmir. Where is Dhanya
kataka of Central South India and where is the Kashmir Valley? This
shows that pisaca was a well spread or well known language of yore.



Some people include it in the Dardic languages. What is the
scholars' stand on this? (elementary question?) ref :
http://www.britannica.com/eb/topic-151511/article-9028763 and
http://www.columbia.edu/itc/mealac/pritchett/00maplinks/overview/lang
uages/languages.html

However, I am wondering if there were any efforts or projects or
books that tried to reconstruct this lost Andhra language just as we
are trying to construct (at least a mythological) Nostratic
language.

The group may please comment on this.



With best regards,



Kishore patnaik



--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "kishore mohan"
<kishore_future@...> wrote:

>
> Telugu is a south Indian langauge, usually clubbed with Dravidian
> languages.
>
> Telugu closely follows Sanskrit in grammar and is spoken by

Andhras

> of Andhra pradesh in India. (Andhra pradesh is one of the major
> states in india and its capital, Hyderabad , is now world famous

as a

> hub of information activities, apart from several other things)
>
> Andhras were a nomadic tribe who have started their journey from
> Maharashtra, from the banks of Andri river. They gave their name

to

> several rivers, including the Handri in kurnool.
>
> This tribe is mentioned in Vedas, Mahabharat and several other
> scriptures.
>
> As per puranic history, Andhra was the seventh son of sudheshna,

a

> queen and Deergha tama, a blind sage. He occupied the coastal

area

> of today's Bay of bengal.
>
> Vanaras were said to be a tribe closely connected to andhras,

perhaps

> a sub-tribe. While Hanuman hails from Maharashtra, the same place
> from where the andhras have emerged, Vanaras have occupied today's
> borders of Andhra Pradesh and Karnataka, both are predominantly
> telugu speaking areas and where you had a highly flourishing

kingdom

> of vijayanagara(today's anantpur and Hampi districts)
>
> Hanuman has written in paisaci, a vanished language today,

supposedly

> the first commentary on Bhagavad gita.
>
> These Andhras have spread all over the country , in kingdoms like
> vatsa, malla, salva and karoosha.
>
> Karoosha, situated on the banks of yamuna ,was in fact ruled by an
> Andhra king, Canura,a great warrior and wrestler and a vassal of

king

> kansa. Sri Krishna has killed canura in a fist fight.
>
> Great people like Bodhayana, Apastamba ( both were law givers) and
> Acarya Nagarjuna (a buddhist monk) were all Andhras/telugus.
>
> It is said canakya, another law giver, is also a telugu man, since

he

> was somewhat black and was having a oordha sikha like telugu

shodiyar

> brahmins.
>
>
> Now coming to the linguistic part of it, the forerunner of telugu
> were dichotomical in nature. there were two languages, desi andhra
> and prakrit andhra. desi andhra is a dardic language and was

spoken

> by echoleon in the society whereas the prakrit andhra is not

really

> known to the today, though it is surmised that it is spoken by the
> common man.
>
> In fact, while desi andhra must hv been spoken by andhras of north
> india, prakrit andhra was spoken by people confined to today's

andhra

> pradesh.( till the times of sata vahanas, this part of the country
> was not much developed)
>
> Since desi andhra is a dardic language, my assumption is that

prakrit

> andhra also must have been a dardic language.
>
>
> what is this prakrit andhra?
>
> In olden days, a language by name paisaci was being mentioned.
> paisaci, though an extinguished language long ago, boasts of great
> works- like an encyclopaedia of surgery and of course, 'brhtkatha'

by

> gunadhya.
>
> the language is said to be so sweet that when gunadya was singing

his

> work, even the animals were spell bound by its sweetness.
>
> A wide spread spectrum of languages, rightly or wrongly, claim
> their origination to paisaci-kashmiri, tulu, tamil etc.
>
> If this is such great and sweet language, then why on earth this

is

> called paisaci?( paisaci- the language of ghosts!)
>
> Once more, in puranas, there is a sect called pisacas but i do not
> think this has got anything to do with them ( just like the way of
> marriage of pisaca has got nothing to do with them)
>
> In olden days, there was a great sage by name dakshina murthy ,
> living in the kalinga kingdom on mahendra giri hills (today's
> srikakulam area, another district in andhra pradesh). he is said

to

> be an avatar of lord siva, coz he adopted the living style of

siva.

>
> True to this saying, his disciples used to be very fierce looking,
> what with their vibhuti, torn clothes, unkempt hair and perhaps

using

> drugs etc.
>
> These people were belonging to the local areas ie they were

andhras.

>
> the andhras spread all over the country must hv spoken only desi
> andhra and it is to the credit of the discipiles of dakshina

murthy

> that the language of common andhra ie prakrit andhra has been
> introduced to the rest of the country. Since these people looked
> like pisacas or ghosts, their langauge was also called paisaci.
>
>
> My feeling is that this is language which is the prakrit andhra.
>
> My reasons are as below:
>
>
> a) As mentioned above, paisaci has emerged in andhra area
>
> b) As mentione above, it is a very sweet language. Traditionally,
> telugu is acclaimed as a very sweet language
>
> c) All the known works of paisaci are written by telugu people-

both

> hanuman and gunadhya are andhrites
>
> d) As mentioned above, paisaci is claimed as a forerunner of both
> dardic language as well as dravid langauges. That is to say, it

has

> characteristics of both dardic language as well as dravid

lanaguage.

> Telugu has also same kind of characteristics.
>
> The geographical proximity to tamilnadu of andhra pradesh has
> resulted in a trace more exhibition of dravidian characteristics

in

> telugu and hence, it is classified as a dravidian langauge.but

truly,

> telugu is not a dravidina langauge. It must have been a dardic
> language, just like kashmiri.
>
> Thus, telugu has emerged from paisaci, which is a forerunner of
> kashmiri too.
>
> I hope the linguists in this group will come up with

substantiating

> arguements.
>
> kishore
>