From: Patrick Ryan
Message: 54836
Date: 2008-03-07
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick McCallister" <gabaroo6958@...>
To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 3:31 PM
Subject: Re: [tied] Re: Swiftness of Indra
> So, if the Romans adapted all the Greek myths of Zeus
> and applied them to Jupiter --that's not merging?
> Have you been smoking psychedelic red herring down
> there in the Ozarks?
>
>
> --- Patrick Ryan <proto-language@...> wrote:
>
> > They merged only in your head.
> >
> > Patrick
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Rick McCallister" <gabaroo6958@...>
> > To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 3:16 PM
> > Subject: Re: [tied] Re: Swiftness of Indra
> >
> >
> > > After they came in contact with the Greeks, Zeus
> > and
> > > Jupiter merged --that's my point and you can't
> > deny
> > > it. So eat your red herrings till you burst.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- Patrick Ryan <proto-language@...> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Absolutely untrue.
> > > >
> > > > As Joao and I have told you: they both stem from
> > a
> > > > common source.
> > > >
> > > > You need to read Harrison.
> > > >
> > > > I did not say Jupiter was a "nature spirit".
> > > >
> > > > He is not a big elf.
> > > >
> > > > He represents sovereignty. Controlling the
> > weather
> > > > is only one of the ways
> > > > he demonstrates his supreme dominion -- but only
> > > > one.
> > > >
> > > > *p&te:r- is not 'biological father' but
> > > > family/clan/tribe leader.
> > > >
> > > > Greek and Roman religion resembled each other
> > long
> > > > before they came into
> > > > regular contact.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Patrick
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Rick McCallister" <gabaroo6958@...>
> > > > To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 12:07 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: [tied] Re: Swiftness of Indra
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > I didn't say he was a nature spirit, you just
> > did.
> > > > But
> > > > > you do have a point in saying that he was
> > because
> > > > a
> > > > > storm god IS a nature spirit
> > > > > Roman religion was originally quite different
> > from
> > > > > Greek religion --at least as different as
> > > > Germanic,
> > > > > Indian, etc. were from Greek
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- Patrick Ryan <proto-language@...>
> > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: "Rick McCallister"
> > <gabaroo6958@...>
> > > > > > To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
> > > > > > Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2008 7:19 PM
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [tied] Re: Swiftness of Indra
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > After contact with Greek religion, Jupiter
> > > > became
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > > clone of Zeus. Before contact with Greek
> > > > religion,
> > > > > > > Roman religion was based on nature spirits
> > and
> > > > > > > reverence to ancestors
> > > > > > > Afterwards, it virtually merged with Greek
> > > > > > religion
> > > > > > > Read the Wikipedia sites on Roman
> > Mythology,
> > > > > > Etruscan
> > > > > > > Mythology, et al.
> > > > > > > I'm guessing you've never read anything
> > about
> > > > > > these
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --- Patrick Ryan <proto-language@...>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > You are always full of specious
> > > > generalizations
> > > > > > > > straight out of Wiki.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Well, you can show I am wrong by
> > discussing
> > > > > > briefly
> > > > > > > > what changed in the
> > > > > > > > Roman conception of Jupiter after
> > contact
> > > > with
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > Greeks.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Patrick
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ***
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So, Jupiter was a nature spirit? How little
> > you
> > > > know
> > > > > > of Roman religion!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Roman and Greek religions both are further
> > > > > > individual developments from the
> > > > > > religion of the Indo-European speakers who
> > > > brought
> > > > > > them forth.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > In that early religion, the supreme god was
> > the
> > > > > > weather/sky-god, of whom
> > > > > > Zeus is the Greek representative and Jupiter
> > the
> > > > > > Roman one.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Having had the same origin, it is quite
> > natural
> > > > that
> > > > > > they had many traits in
> > > > > > common. If the Romans had never come into
> > actual
> > > > > > contact with the Greek,
> > > > > > Zeus and Jupiter would have resembled each
> > > > other.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Actually, I have read a great deal about
> > ancient
> > > > > > religion; and, at my
> > > > > > website, I have a separate section of
> > several
> > > > essays
> > > > > > under the rubric
> > > > > > Proto-Religion.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Why not illustrate wuth an example or two
> > how
> > > > > > Jupiter was transformed by
> > > > > > Roman contact with Greece.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Was he a nature spirit before? Was Zeus?
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Patrick
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
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