Re: Bird (was: Renfrew's theory renamed as Vasco-Caucasian)

----- Original Message -----

From: tgpedersen

To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 4:41 AM

Subject: [tied] Re: Bird (was: Renfrew's theory renamed as Vasco-Caucasian)

> > *ekYspteryó/ekYspetn yó+ 'out from under wing'
> > *ekYspteryó/ekYspetn yó+s 'fledgling'
> >
> >
> > From PIE to:
> >
> > *ekYspetnyó+ > *essidnyo+ > *essi:ne/isse: ne > MIr essíne, Gaelic
> > isean 'young bird, chicken'
> >
> >
> > *ekYspteryó+
> > *ekYpteryó+
> > *ekYpretyó+
> > *epretyó+
> > *ephrethyó+
> > *ebhredhyó+
> > *ebredyó+
> > *ebredyá+
> > *ibridyá+
> > *bridyá+
> >
> > OE bridd / bird 'young bird, chicken'
> >
>
> This is easier: from some substrate with p,t > bh,dh (> b,d in
> Germanic) *bed-ro- > *bred-ro- > bridd
>
> Actually Holzer claims to have found *bedro "feather, wing"
> (supposedly < PIE *pet-ro) in his Temematic substrate in Slavic, cf
> http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ cybalist/ message/32179
> namely in names of certain plants (with composite, 'gefiederte'
> leaves) and insects.
>
> He also lists bedro "thigh" as a temematic word (supposedly <
> *ped-ro). I wonder if they are the same word and related to *p-t-
> "open up"? Møller does list that *p-t- with Semitic cognates.
> Following his own rules for accounting for 'Noreen alternation'
> http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ cybalist/ message/27999
> http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ cybalist/ message/47591
> one could set up a root *bhedh- alternating with *pet-, and then
> there would be no need for a Temematic substrate; some of Holzer's
> Temematic words have strange Noreen alternations in Germanic too,
> ie. PIE pork^o- vs. Du. varken, Ger. Verkel, Gothic barg-s "pig"

I was wondering if Romanian pasãre "bird", Latin passer, Gothic
sparwa, Hesych sparásios, Epic Greek psé:r "sparrow" were all < PIE
*pte-ro "bird" in some dialectal way? That would by the way make the
Caland suffix *-ro = the 'Old Europen'(?) bird suffix *-er (passer,
anser, Eng. Gander etc).

http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ cybalist/ message/19521
http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ cybalist/ message/37414
http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ cybalist/ message/37446
http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ cybalist/ message/38305
http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ cybalist/ message/50435

Torsten