Re: [tied] Vowel Lengthening from V + Voiced Stop (was Vowel Lengt

On 2006-10-03 05:44, Patrick Ryan wrote:

>> But if you are referring to the affect of the following
>> voiced/unvoiced consonant, my proposed solution would be to average
>> the durations of the two extremes.
>
> Which is what I proposed in my reply to Petr, didn't I?

> Sorry, I see no mention of it in that message.

I meant the following passage, suggesting that the pre-sonorant quantity
was average and therefore "normal".

>>> Note that vowel length before sonorant consonants (liquids and
>>> nasals) is almost precisely intermediate between the durations
>>> found in pre-lenis and pre-fortis contexts. Sonorants are
>>> phonetically voiced, but their voicing is phonologically
>>> non-distictive. RELATIVE to the pre-sonorant position,
>>> distinctively voiced consonants lengthen vowels, whereas
>>> distinctively voiceless ones shorten them.


> I am not talking about averaging the [I]'s of <bid> and <bit> but
> rather the [I]'s of <bidet> and <bitumen>.

But this is hardly a useful standard measure, given the fact that such a
metrically weak /I/ is often instable, and many speakers pronounce it as
a schwa (as in <bitumen>) or, conversely, use /i:/ instead (thus often
in <bidet>).

Piotr