[tied] Re: Permian

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Piotr Gasiorowski <gpiotr@...> wrote:

>
> On 2006-04-20 11:15, Piotr Gasiorowski wrote:
>
> >> You said something about the semantic field of *bhrem- :
> >
> > Without claiming any connection with <Bremen>.
>
> I should add that the name of the city doesn't have to have

anything do

> with the 'edge' word. Its early versions point to <Breme> as the
> original form, most likely a plural (cf. Latinised Bremae, abl. de
> Bremis), and the modern version continues the dat.pl. used in

locative

> phrases (van Bremen = de Bremis). Whatever the underlying

appellative,

> it's likely to have been something that naturally occurs as a

plural, so

> the best fit is perhaps not 'edge' but 'bramble-bush' or 'thorn-

bush'

> (*bre:m-(j)o:- beside variants with a shortened root vowel, cf. OHG
> bra:ma, brema, MLG breme, OE bro:m, bre:mel). Pokorny lumps the two
> etyma together (with the semantics of 'stick out'), but I see

little

> reason to do so, given the different vocalism. There may be a

distant

> connection with the OE 'briar' word (WS bræ:r, Angl. bre:r).

Aren't brambles plants of a type generally referred to in the country
side as existing at the edges or borders of forests, farms, ditches
etc?

Regards
Andrew