Re: [tied] IIr 2nd Palatalisation (was: PIE voiceless aspirates)

From: Miguel Carrasquer
Message: 42036
Date: 2005-11-10

On Thu, 10 Nov 2005 01:57:21 -0600, Patrick Ryan
<proto-language@...> wrote:

[mcv:]
>> <kis> obviously can't be o-grade. It's an irregular form
>> without palatalization (analogical after <kas>, and other
>> pronouns with -i-/-o- alternation)
>
>***
>Patrick:
>
>I guess you mean PIE *ki-s

*kWis

>>
>> >before *a: (*aH) - ka:s-
>> >
>> >When I see imperative kuru, I suspect that karo:ti may be the result of
>> >zero-grade as well: *kWréuti > *k(u)róti > *k-a-róti
>> >
>> >Is that basically how you see it?
>
>
>***
>Patrick:
>
>You did not comment on karoti above. Could you please?

karo:ti is somehow derived from kr.no:ti. The exact path is
unclear. See LIV p. 392 for two possibilities.

>> >********************
>> >
>> >> >PIE *k produces OI <k>;
>> >>
>> >> Which was palatalized to <c> before front vowels and /j/.
>> >
>> >I have gone through the *k section in Pokorny for initials, and can find
>> >only
>> >
>> >candati, *(s)kendeti (metathesized from *(s)ked-n-)
>> >camara, *kem-
>>
>> You missed a few: cé:s,t,ati, cyávate:, ca:s.a, có:pati,
>> perhaps more.
>
>***
>Patrick:
>
>I am still unable to find these forms in Pokorny. Could you please supply
>the PIE forms?

cé:s.t.ati, cyávate:, *ke:i- p. 539
ca:s.a, 4. *kel- p. 547
cr.táti, *kert p. 584
có:pati, *kew@... p. 596

>***
>
>> >
>> >Of course. I am used to writing <S> for <s> (from the time that esh could
>> >not easily be inserted into email)
>>
>> There are two eshes in Sanskrit: <s'> and <s.>.
>
>***
>Patrick:
>
>How totally novel to call two letters by the same name!
>
>I thought <s.> was a retroflex. Am I wrong?

In the sense that Polish <sz> and Mandarin <sh> are
retroflex.

Sanskrit <s'> is equivalent to Polish <s'> and Mandarin <x>.


=======================
Miguel Carrasquer Vidal
mcv@...