[tied] Re: Apple

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Rob" <magwich78@...> wrote:

> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, mkapovic@... wrote:
> > > --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "grzegorj2000"

<grzegorj2000@...>

> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> And, with another metathesis: Latin ma:lum, Greek me:lon <

*maHlo-,

> > >> Hittite mahla- "grape-vine" (and maybe Slavic

malina "raspberry"

> > >> also belongs here).
> > >
> > > Those could easily be from a native IE word *méxlom, from *mex-
> > > 'provide, feed, nurture'. In fact, the reflexes in the

attested

> > > languages are very clear: Slavic /a/ is from /a:/ or /o:/, and
> > > Hittite preserves /h/. Is the -ina in Slavic _malina_ a

diminutive

> > > ending? If so, then the meaning "raspberry" can be understood

to

> > > come from "little apple".
> >
> > _malina_ is usually interpreted as from IE *mel(H)- "black"

(via

> > vrddhi *mo:l-). The accentuation does not point to the laryngeal

in

> > the root.
>
> What is the accentuation there?
>
> What could have caused the vrddhi?
>
> Finally, and perhaps most importantly, raspberries aren't black.
>
> - Rob

Accentuation: Russian, Bulgarian ma'lina (stress on -i-), Ukrainian
ma'lyna, Serbo-Croat 'malina (short rising intonation).
Semantics: "raspberry" everywhere, and also "mulberry" (Morus,
fruit) in Serbo-Croat (together with "raspberry", see Vasmer).

The suffix -ina is not diminutive, it seems to form some classes of
nomina attributiva rather, and it can be found, among others, in
names of bushes (esp. with edible/usable fruits) like Russian
buzi'na "Sambucus" (with different accentuation!), Russian rja'bina
= Polsh jarze,bina "rowan-berry, Sorbus aucuparia",
ka'lina "Viburnum opulus", Russ. oz^ina = Pol. jez.yna "blackberry,
Rubus".

If Slavic *ma:l-i:na: from the same *ma:l- which can be seen in
Latin or Greek, the relation between the two forms would be of the
same kind as in Polish jarza,b : jarze,bina (both with essentially
the same meaning "Sorbus aucuparia", the former more "official" and
the latter more popular).

Grzegorz J.