Re: [tied] Root of "marten," "sable"

This relation between Germanic *harman (OE hearma=OHG harmo) and Lithuanian s^ermuo resembles that between Germanic helmaz "helmet" and Lithuanian s^almas/ Slavic slemU.

Did they reflect a common PIE source (*k^-), or a loan from German to Baltic? If it was a loan, how to explain *x > s^ ?

Joao SL

"C. Darwin Goranson" <cdog_squirrel@...> escreveu:

I've seen the Germanic *marthuz attested to, but can't the root be taken further? Are there any other potential synonyms in other Indo-European groups that could be traceable to a PIE root? Relatedly, I've heard that the word "sable' comes from the Russian "sobol," but where would that arise from? As well, the word "ermine," I've heard, could arise from "mus Armenius" or from a word akin to the Lithuanian "sarmuo~" and a relative of the English "hoary," with a PIE root as "gray." Which is most probable, the Armenian mouse or the Gray one? And if it's the latter, does that denote a fear for it like that for the hare, or might it be a reverence, since weasels would have eaten rodents and lagomorphs such as hares? I write stories with such creatures as protagonists, so with an interest in languages and proto-languages (especially Proto-Indo-European) this is a natural thing for me to study.

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