Re: IE "River", what are the

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "George Hinge" <litgh@...> wrote:

>
> The Danish toponym Isefjord probably has an original long initial

i

> like the Icelandic toponym Ísafjörður. In modern Danish it may be
> pronounced both with a short or long i with a typical shortening

in

> the first part of a compound, but the optional long vowel, the

closed

> quality of the vowel and the traditional spelling certainly

indicate

> that we have Old Danish long i. (Furthermore, in Snorri

Sturluson's

> Heimskringla, Isefjord is rendered Ísafjo,rðr, but I don't know if
> the acute is supported by the manuscripts.)
>
> The long i suggests that the toponym is derived from the common
> appellative _is_ [i:'s] "ice" and not from the Indo-European root
> *ish2-, which would regularily have turned up with a short i in

the

> Germanic dialects.
>
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Brian M. Scott" <BMScott@...>
> wrote:
> > At 7:12:14 AM on Tuesday, April 12, 2005, tgpedersen wrote:
> >
> > > --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Piotr Gasiorowski
> > > <gpiotr@...> wrote:
> >
> > >> tgpedersen wrote:
> >
> > >>> Do you propose the same origin for Danish 'ising', that
> > >>> strong vigorous flatfish, living among other places on
> > >>> the bottom of the strong vigorous inlet of Isefjord in
> > >>> northern Sjælland?
> >
> > >> No, why should I?
> >
> > > Because is- occurs in hydronyms all over Europe, and it
> > > would be nice to have single origin for them all. Do you
> > > have any IE proposals for 'ising' and 'Isefjord'?
> >
> > I don't know about that Isefjord, but <Isefjær> in
> > <Isefjærfjorden> (fjord in Lillesand commune) is taken to be
> > from ON *Ísafjo,rðr, from the gen.pl. of <íss> 'ice' and
> > <fjo,rðr>.

Norsk Stadnamnlexikon:
Isane [i:s`an,e] three farms ... Bremanger hd, SogFj
i Midiijsum ca.1360
i Ystum Isum 1348
must be pl of. ONo íss "ice" but it is difficult to say how it is to
be interpreted; here are no glaciers; the fjord outside is Isefjorden

Stednavneordbog:
Isen
1506 Ysen
The original name of Isenbæk, from a root meaning "moving swiftly"

Ishøj
Ishogh 1279
Yshøhæ 1280
"The hills on which there is often much ice" (??)

Issehoved (peninsula)
Isehouet 1659
Iise Houffued 1682

Isøre
Ysora 1257
(at Isefjord)

Feilberg: Ordbog over jyske Almuesmaal
is-kul (Råbjerg s.o. Skagen) [kul = coal]
pieces up to a foot across of lava or pumice with regular large
round cavities ... has told me that he always could find pieces pof
it on the beach and that this lava earlier under the name 'iskul'
was collected by smiths ... Is found regularly on the coast in
Denmark, but without a particular name and probably all the way to
France



Perhaps *i:s- is shallow water?


Torsten