Re: [tied] Stative Verbs, or Perfect Tense

P&G <G&P@...> wrote:

 > But that is diffferent from the pattern we see in Greek
and Latin, where the present meaning is far and away uppermost - e.g.:
              Vixerunt (Cicero's famous one-word speech) = They are dead.
               Fuit Ilium   = Troy is no more.
I quote these from Latin, because the Latin use of the pefect as a past
tense is widely known, and its use in this sense is less appreciated.  In
Greek it is the only use.

Yes, they may have a present meaning, but one that must be expressed by a different verb.  Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't "vixerunt" signify not that "they are dead", but rather that they once "lived", in the past, but not anymore in the present?  Same with "fuit", meaning Troy once was, in the past, but not anymore in the present.  The primary meaning is that something once occurred, and from there one can derive a present meaning using an entirely different verb or different adjectives or adverbs, which adjectives or adverbs themselves denote the idea of a changed state, the change occurring at any time before the immediate present ("dead" = "formerly alive", "no more" = "formerly existing").  I would therefore not count the examples you give as examples of verbs in the perfect having present meaning, rather I would call them examples of verbs which indicate a former state, a past state, that is no more. 

Andrew