--- In
cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "alexandru_mg3" <alexandru_mg3@...>
wrote:
> So it can be from :
> 1. an Ancient Balkan language (pre-/proto- Albanian?)
> 2. Greek?
> 3. other source (Iranian etc...)?
>
> I will come back with more details on these hypothesis.
A. As forms of the word *stapanu we have:
1. Albanian Gheg shtëpâ 'cheesemaker'
2. Albanian Tosk shtëpresë/shtëpreshë - Gheg shpneshë 'female
cheesemaker'
3. Both Albanian words indicating also a lost Tosk form m. *shtëpër
3. Romanian stãpân 'master, lord'
4. The Slavic word *stopanU is only present in South Slavic so is
not a Slavic Inherited word or an old loan in Slavic -> in other
words this is not an Old Common Slavic Word.
B. For the phonetism of the forms above and the related timeframes
we have:
1. N-Rothacism in Tosk shtëpresë/*shtëpër
-> No Slavic loan in Albanian present Tosk rothacism
2. There is no other South Slavic loan in Romanian or Albanian
showing a today South Slavic o for Romanian a or for Albanian a
3. On the other side a South Slavic o for a Romanian ã ~ Alb ë is
quite normal because initially South Slavic didn't have the Rom.ã~
Alb.ë sound. This sound was acquired later due to the Balkanic
influence.
All these arguments indicate that *stapanus is a more probably a
Balkanic Word - a Substratual word in Romanian and Albanian, that was
loaned in South Slavic from Romanian or from Gheg (because Tosk form
was already *shtëpër- at that time).
The loan happened when its form was in ORom. *stãpãnu (ORom ã >
South Slavic o).
South Slavic a > o was already ended before the first Slavic loan
in Romanian and Albanian.
Only The Bests,
Marius
Note regarding : PAlb. ën ~ PRom ãn>ORom ân for an original *an (this
common Romanian / Albanian transformation is present in Romanian and
Albanian Only in Latin Loans and in Inherited Words with some
possible exceptions (considered Slavic loans in Romanian with a lot
of reserves by Romanian linguists):
1. Rom. jupân < ORom g^upân (no other Slavic loan in Romanian
shows ORom g^ > Rom. j - as Latin Loans in Romanians show.
The Romanian old dialectal forms present also the n-rothacism
in Romanian : g^upâr -> No Slavic loan in Romanian shows the n-
rothacism in Romanian.
Regarding Sl. z^upanU -> this word is not considered an
Inherited Slavic Word but probably a loan in Slavic(see at Skok,
Berneker)
2. Rom. stâncã 'stone' ~ Alb. sthëng 'bread/soil consistent
like a stone', Sl. *stena > dim. *stenka
3. Rom. smântânã 'cream' Sl. *sum~etana Lith. smantas
Today Slavic forms point to an OSl. form *sumetana and not *sum~etana)
Only Romanian and Lithuanian forms show *ant, Slavic forms
show *et
4. Rom stânã 'sheep folder' , Sl. stana 'station'
--- In
cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "alexandru_mg3" <alexandru_mg3@...>
wrote:
>
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Miguel Carrasquer <mcv@...> wrote:
> >If Slavic /o/ was still /a/, then Slavic *stapa:nU could
> >very well yield Rom. *stapanu > stãpân. There is no
> >problem. Since the word is attested in Bulgarian and
> >Serbian, and not in Latin, it stands to reason that the
> >direction of borrowing was Slavic > Romanian.
>
> Your argument is not sufficient to prove the borrowing direction.
> Why?
> Because : is this word Rom. *stapanu > stãpân attested in any
other
> Slavic Language but the South Slavic?
> As I know, it isn't. So is not a Slavic Inherited word.
>
> And not only that is not an inherited word but the loan moment in
> South Slavic appeared to be AFTER the split of Slavic languages so
> just recently (based on the same argument that the other Slavic
> languages don't have this word).
>
> Now the question is the following:
>
> From where the South Slavic borrowed this word?
>
> From Latin from sure not.
>
> So it can be from :
> 1. an Ancient Balkan language (pre-/proto- Albanian?)
> 2. Greek?
> 3. other source (Iranian etc...)?
>
> I will come back with more details on these hypothesis.
>
> Best Regards,
> Marius