[tied] Re: "vatër" vs "vatra"; "veter-" vs "batran"

m_iacomi wrote:

>> but you are wrong when you speak about "calb"="vãtui".
>> ( NEVER CALB;for calb you have MÂNZAT).
>
> So what? Existence of a word for designing a `one-year-old-calb`
> doesn't exclude using for `baby animal` the word "vãtui".

It doesn't exclude in your rationament. The languages show the
contrary.
There is no used. There is no vãtui= vitelus. From DEX:

vãtui=ied sau pui de iepure ( _pâna la un an_). Pielea ( prelucrata)
a puiului _de caprioara_.
Where do you make the connection with "calb"? Just with the Latin
word in your head and nothing more.




For vitelus= mânzat. Because so is the language, it doesnt fit in the
Latin "camisia" ( a germanic loan in fact)

> Not being able to spell a word, you should use copy/paste (compare
> *vituleus with *vetuleus and judge by yourself). Since we have in
> Aromanian "vitul'u" (meaning `one year old baby goat`) and in
> Meglenoromanian "vitul'/vitui" (meaning `young baby goat`), one
> can safely infer that there was originally a word with palatalized
> /l'/ and with meaning related to `young animal`, not to `old(er)`,
> in Common Romanian. That rules out your "regional meaning" (which
> I'll surely check out); also the second meaning (`leather`) points
> out clearly reference to young, not old animals.

Fortunately Master Rosetti showed you there that in Aromanian _ in
many
times_ there is an palatal "l" from "i" and not an "i" from "l". Do
you
remember about?

More as this. It does not make any sense to have a "vitelus" = calb
from
latin "vitulus"= calb, but to have "baby" from a derivate of latin
'vitelus' which looks absolutely different : vãtui/viTel. It is
crystal clear
there are two different roots:
vet- and vit-

>
>> The fact the word is not related to any "calb" since for calb
>> there is mânzat, [...]
>
> That's Alex "reasoning". In fact, a specialized word can make
> another one with overlapping semantism to change its meaning.
> That is: concurrence between "*mãndzatu" and "*vãtul'u" (probable
> Common Romanian forms) caused the semantic drift of the latter.
> Of course, existence of a word for `one-year-old-calb` has no
> probing relevance in which concerns relationship of another word
> with `calb`.

Fact is: seeing there is no vãtui= calb, then there is no basis for
linking it to a pseudolatin word and _we are obliged_ to link it to
the
known word "vetus" which fits perfectly without any abracadabra.
And the existence of albanian "vjetak"= one year old baby for animals
_should be enough_ to explain the sense here. Are you indeed not
wantig
to see it or what about ?

>
>> So there is no basis for making any connection between vãtui
>> and "vitulus" but a more stronger basis for "vãtui" with "vetus"
>
> According to meanings and phonetism, that's simply false.

According to Mr Iacomi maybe. Acording to fonetism is true, acording
to
meaning too is true. You showed that words "specialise" . And "vetus"
became special in Rom. " old, but not too old. Just one year old".

>
>> In the same manner is to make the corelation with Alb "vjet"
>
> OK, up to infirmation of your alleged "regional meaning", people
> of Prahova are Albanian-related. :-)

>> Mr Iacomi it seems you missed the whole discution here otherways
>> you won't say a such nonsense. There is no "vitel" from "vitelus"
>> and that not because of "T" and there is no "viaTa" from "vita".
>> I don't guess there is any need to re-debate it.
>
> Of course there is no "vitelus" > "viTel". See for reference the
> message you missed a long time ago:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/18761
> Also check:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/21939
> There is indeed no need to spread confused nonsense on the list.
> There is no need to fight against supposed etymologies invented
> by yourself and attributed to others. The remaining part is just
> willful ignoring of what has already been said on this list: it
> would be very nice if you'd eliminate it from your posts.
>
> Marius Iacomi

Haide frate, lasa-ma., from vitelus you _must_ have "vãTel". In Latin
"vitelus" is a short "i" and out.