[tied] Re: vulgar Latin-2?

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Abdullah Konushevci"
<a_konushevci@...> wrote:

> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Miguel Carrasquer <mcv@...> wrote:
> > On Thu, 01 May 2003 22:39:32 +0000, Abdullah Konushevci
> > <a_konushevci@...> wrote:
> >
> > >Yes, but *ab-, as Celtic proves it, is just, I guess, a voiced
> > >variant form.
> >
> > With voicing caused by the suffix *-Hon-, which is absent from
> avull.
> > PIE *p, or in fact any PIE voiceless stop, just does not become
> voiced
> > in Albanian, except after nasal (nëndë "9" < *neun-ti).
> >
> >
> > =======================
> > Miguel Carrasquer Vidal
> > mcv@...
> ************
> ENTRY: euh1-
>
> DEFINITION: To leave, abandon, give out, whence nominal derivatives
> meaning abandoned, lacking, empty. Oldest form *h1euh2-, zero-grade

*

> h1uh2-, with variant form *h1weh2-, colored and contracted to *wa:-

.

> 1. Suffixed form *wh-no-. a. wane; wanton, from Old English wanian,
> to lessen (from Germanic *wane:n), and wan-, without; b. want, from
> Old Norse vanta, to lack, from North Germanic *wanat n. 2. Suffixed
> form *wa: -no-. vain, vanity, vaunt; evanesce, vanish, from Latin
> va:nus, empty. 3. Extended form *wak-. vacant, vacate, vacation,
> vacuity, vacuum, void; avoid, devoid, evacuate, from Latin vaca:re
> (variant voca:re), to be empty. 4. Extended and suffixed form *was-

to-

> . waste; devastate, from Latin va:stus, empty, waste. (Watkins euh1-

,

> Pokorny 1. eu- 345.)
>
> As You could see, in no variant, this PIE root has nothing to do

with

> <steam> or <vapour>, neither in other languages derives such

meanings.

> For that reason, didn't You appreciate it a little bit unexepted.
> With PIE root *ap- 'water' and its voiced variants in Celtic and
> Persian, *ab- I thing that it fits better.
> Nevertheless, You are right that unvoiced stops in Albanian become
> voiced only after nasals: pasi/mbasi 'after, when',
> prapa/mbrapa 'behind', etc.
>

There are also in Albanian verb ul 'to wet', besides qull < q-
+ull 'to over wet, to soak' and nyll < n + ull 'to make bread soaked,
when one breaks it immediately after it gets from oven and steam
don't vanished, but turned into water'.
So, for me, the doubt exists: did we have to do at all with a suffix -
ull in words av-ull 'steam, vapour', ak-ull 'ice', mjerg-ull 'fog' or
we have to deal with compound nouns, derived in accordance with an
existed paradigm, second element of which was -ull 'water'.

Konushevci