From: Miguel Carrasquer
Message: 18928
Date: 2003-02-20
>Miguel:It's indeed a question of voice onset time and tongue position.
>>Thinking about what I said above, I ran the files for intervocalic /m/
>>(Cons13b.wav /ama/) and /n/ (Cons15b.wav /ana/) through the analyzer tool.
>
>It's great to see that you're busying yourself with such
>fruitless projects. Do you think that there is only one way
>of saying /ama/ or /ana/?
>
>I grew up with English, speak French... cuz afterall, I'm
>Canadian :) ..., and have a basic knowledge of Mandarin. I can
>perceive a difference between the /d/ of English, that of French,
>and even that of Mandarin. It all has to do with voicing onset,
>tongue position and perhaps even the quality of the voicing
>itself. French /d/ comes across as being the "breathiest" of all,
>while Mandarin /d/ sounds the most constricted in comparison.
>So likewise, I have to wonder which "m" is being pronounced inBecause the relative frequencies of the first and second formants I
>those wav files of yours. Sometimes an /m/ can be pronounced
>quite short to the point that it almost sounds like /b/ or /p/.
>Sometimes it can be quite nasalized. There are many ways of
>pronouncing this "m", depending on your pattern of speech.
>
>Why don't you address that, rather than superfluous talk about
>an f1 and f2 of an unspecified "m"? We don't know whether the
>data you present has been biased with lurking variables such
>as these.
>>The raising effect caused by nasals in general (e > i, o > u, a > &) isNasalization and raising are two independent effects caused by nasals.
>>caused by [...]
>
>More irony...
>
>How come nasalization in Pre-IE is supposed to _prevent_ *a
>from becoming a HIGHER *o then?? Everything you've said above
>is opposite to what you've claimed for Pre-IE. You're disproving
>yourself!