Re: [tied] Dirmar

This is circular, isn't it, as far as <Dirmar> is concerned, and since the name <Itimari> is equally opaque (and potentially garbled) there is no ground for extracting an ethnonymic suffix from either. Has anyone reconstructed Iranian *mar- 'men, people'? I don't know of such a word. Like Indic, Iranian has derivatives of the _root_ *mar- (< PIE *mer- 'die') meaning 'mortal, human, man', but they are suffixations like *mart(i)ya- (OPer. martiya, Farsi mard). I find it odd that Maenchen-Helfen refers to Tomaschek and Markwart only, though Iranian studies in general and Iranian onomastics in particular have advanced considerably over the past century.

Piotr

----- Original Message -----
From: george knysh

To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2001 6:39 PM

Subject: [tied] Dirmar

Otto Maenchen-Helfen (The World of the Huns, University of California Press 1973, p. 453, n. 62) relies on earlier analyses by Tomaschek (SB Wien 1888, p. 17) and Markwart Osteuropaeische und ostasiatische Streifzuege, 1903, p. 356) to argue that Iranian "mar" (men, people) is used as a compounding element in ethnonyms. The examples offered are Dirmar ("from the Syrian list of 555") and Itimar (from Priskos and Jordanes). As for Jord. this likely refers to the following passage:

"mox ingentem illam paludem transierunt, ilico Alpidzuros, Alcildzuros, Itimaros, Tuncarsos et Boiscos, qui ripae istius Scythiae insedebant, quasi quaedam turbo gentium rapuerunt." (GET. XXIV)

[Like a whirlwind of nations, they swept across the great swamp and at once fell upon the Alpidzuri, Alcildzuri, Itimari, Tuncarsi and Boisci, who bordered on that part of Scythia.]