Re: [tied] Scythian tribal names

O.K., You've convinced me about the Alans' name. I forgot about
the Chinese attestation. But I've never heard of the Dirmar.
Could you tell me where I could find out more about them?
-David

--- In cybalist@..., george knysh <gknysh@...> wrote:
>
> *****GK: Your point about the "Germani" and the
> "Sauromatoi" is good and reflects my own conviction.
> It may not apply to the case of the Alani however.
> Ammianus Marcellinus has this to say about the issue
> (History, XXXI,13):
>
> "hoc transito [the Don GK] in inmensum extentas
> Scythiae solitudines Halani inhabitant, ex montium
> appellatione cognominati, paulatimque nationes
> conterminas crebritate victoriarum adtritas ad
> gentilitatem sui vocabuli traxerunt, ut Persae."
>
> A similar conclusion was drawn by historians in
> connection with the use of the term "Alan" in Chinese
> chronicles, and by epigraphic inscriptions of the
> Bosporus Kingdom. Ammianus adds in nother context that
> the "Halani" are divided into many "gentes" (which he
> does not name) and clearly differentiates them from
> the "Sauromatae". It cannot be categorically ruled out
> that "Alan" was a self-designation for many cognate
> tribes at a particular moment in time. Nor can it be
> ruled out that this might have changed (some sort of
> return to the status quo ante?) once the tribes whose
> "victoriae" had led to the spread of their name to
> include others moved out of the area. And then "Return
> of the As"? Perhaps. In the 6th century the main
> Iranic tribal group of the Don to Volga steppe was
> called the "Dirmar". Perhaps they also had once been
> "Alans".*****