From: João S. Lopes Filho
Message: 10664
Date: 2001-10-27
----- Original Message -----
From: Sergejus Tarasovas <S.Tarasovas@...>
To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2001 8:47 AM
Subject: [tied] Re: Interpreting some Scythian names
> --- In cybalist@..., george knysh <gknysh@...> wrote:
>
> >here's a translation of
> > a Petrovian footnote on the Scythian River Mother
> > Goddess API (SE, p.153, n2: "Of all Indo-European
> > languages the word API is closest to the Baltic
> > lexicon. Cf. OlPr "APE" ("river": Elbing glossary,62);
> > Lith., Latv. "UPE". Compare Hitt. "HAP" "river"
> > "stream".
>
> > And
> > here's another one about the Scythian Goddess "TABITI"
> > (SE, p. 154): "Scythian TABITI" meant "she who is the
> > best" "she who is the most accomplished" "she who is
> > the highest" (cpre Lith. "TOBULAS"= "accomplished",
> > "TOBULETI" = "to make one's self better, more
> > accomplished", "TOBULYBE" = "accomplishment,
> > superiority". According to E. Fraenkel (Litauisches
> > Etymologisches Woerterbuch, II, 1105) the word
> > "TOBULAS" "has no etymology" and is without close
> > analogies in other Indo-European languages: which
> > testifies to the deep archaism of this Balto-Scythian
> > name."******
>
> I did my best trying to find a convincing etymology for Lith.
> <to'bulas> 'perfect' in the sources at hand, but I failed. Still I
> can hardly believe nothing has changed since Fraenkel's times (his
> dictionary represents mostly the achievements of pre-World War II
> linguistics), so I won't give up.
> Among others which have occured to me, the following tentative guess
> seemes to be the most "stable": probably we deal with a s-less
> variant of PIE *steh2- 'stand, stay etc', so the word in question
> could be etymologized as a deverbative < *to'b- 'to be finished'
> (<'to be unchangable' > 'to be perfect', the -ul-suffix is often used
> in derivations [mediopassive verb]>[adjective with the
> meaning 'having quality of']) < *(s)teh2-bh- (such -bh-derivatives
> are not very common, but are still registered for Baltic, Germanic
> and Indo-Arian) 'to be unchangable', cf. accentological
> characteristics of the word (acute stressed oxytonon).
>
> As for the comparison of ("Scythian", according to Herodotus) <Api'>
> ~ Baltic *a`pe: (if the East Baltic forms are indeed of secondary
> origin, < *h2p- is not impossible, and we would have to speak of West
> Baltic *a`pe: vs. East Baltic *u`pe: in that case) < *h2ap- and
> <Tabiti'> ~ (unregistered) Baltic **ta:bi:te:, they are not
> impossible from the formal point of view. The origin of the Baltic
> nominal ending *-e:~ is disputable, the two competing hypotheses
> being < 1. *-j-eh2 (in which case the circumplex would be of
> metatonic origin) 2. *-i-:-ei-:-oi- stems (like Latin re:s < *ri-
> :*rei-:*roi-), but in any case "Scythian" <-i'> ~ Baltic *-e: looks
> normal. Again, formant -y'te.-:-y~te. < -i:t-e: (with prosodical
> vaccilation between dialects) is common in Lithuanian, the major
> meanings being 'having the quality of' (also used to form nomina
> collectiva, esp. toponyms), so **Ta:bi:te: doesn't look impossible as
> well. The only problem is that two examples are not enough to approve
> or reject such ad hoc'ish explanations. It would be nice if you
> provided me with at least 20-30 of Petrov's Scytho-Baltic
> counterparts.
>
> Another question is how Petrov has come to the semantics like 'River
> Mother Goddess' for <Api'> and 'she who is the best' for <Tabiti'>.
> Herodotus in his History writes (4.59.1):
>
> theou`s me`n mou'nous tou'sde hila'skontai Histi'e:v me`n ma'lista
> epi` de` Di'a kai` Ge:~n nomi'zontes te:`n Ge:~n tou~ Dio`s ei~nai
> gunai~ka
> ...
> onoma'zetai de` skuthisti` Histi'e: me`n Tabiti' ... Ge:~ de` Api'
>
> Just that. In 4.127.1 he adds that Idanthyrsus stated that:
>
> despo'tas de` emou`s ego:` Di'a te nomi'zo: to`n emo`n pro'gonon kai`
> Histi'e:n te:`n Skuthe'o:n basi'leian mou'nous ei~nai
>
> So, <Api'> is The Earth, the wife of Zeus. No river-like
> connotations. Hestia 'is called' <Tabiti'> and is
> worshipped 'especially' (ma'lista), she's 'queen of the Scythians',
> but this special treatment still doesn't imply her Scythian _name_
> means 'the best'. As for Hestia, she, whatever be it's Greek name's
> etymology, is a goddes of the hearth, no more 'perfect' than other
> goddeses. The Herodotus' analogy can be easily explained in the light
> of most (East-)Iranians being fire-worshippers. So, in semantic
> terms, so to say, Petrov's comparison is ungrounded and must be
> rejected.
>
> Sergei
>
>
>
>
>
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