--- In cybalist@..., markodegard@... wrote:
> While the Apam Napat/Child of the Waters myth is quite real, and
most
> certainly of IE origin, it is nonetheless quite vague fragmentary
and
> characgter, and is quite difficult to adequately characterize.
>
> Essentially, it's the nationalistic hero being being received by
> watery female divinities, and thereby somehow 'consecrated' to some
> noble nationalistic task. He seems to receive gifts, clothes
> particularly. The hero is always very respectful towards the women
he
> meets.
>
> I have a number of speculations. This could be an adoption/marital
> ceremony, where an unrelated male is adopted into a clan by the
> females, perhaps as a variation on the usual matrilocality.
> Alternatively, it could be some sort of 'coronation' ceremony,
where a
> leader is consecrated.
> One idea I've consdered is that this is a fragment of "the women's
> religion". I believe we have overemphasized IE religion's
patriarchal
> nature.
>
> I have difficulty seeing H. or D. as explicit examples of this.
Hmmm. That's intersting. I might connect it to a rite of passage
ceremony, transition between child and man. Being submerged under
water, and receiving gifts/powers there, and then re-emerging, recall
both the hero's journey to the underworld and also, the
watery "second birth" of the hero, who is raised/suckled by a goddess
or wild animal(As described by Otto Renk in "The Myth of the Birth of
the Hero") after being cast into a river or the sea.
So, the nationalistic task that Apam Napat is supposed to do could be
a heroic task. The nationalistic nature of it suggests a role of
cultural hero.
Apam Napat is considered the god of fresh waters, as is Poseidon. I
know Joao S. Lopes Filho has mentioned before the possibility of a
connection between the two. Poseidon was cared for by watery mythic
figures, the Telchines, at the bottom of the ocean. The Telchines
were said to have fashioned Poseidon's Trident, a possible indicator
of a gift given to him there(In all fairness, this isn't the only
weapon of the gods that the Teclchines were have said to forged, and
were known for their metalworking ability)
In another version of the myth, Poseidon is again cared for by the
Telchines. This time, Kronos is out to eat Poseidon. This version of
the myth is almost identical to the myth of Dictaen Zeus and the
Curetes.
In this myth, Zeus was said to have been protected by the dancing
leaping Curetes, who wielded spears and figure-eight shields
(ancillae). They drowned out the sound of baby Zeus' cries with the
noise they made with their dances and commotion.
In Themis by Jane Ellen Harrison, Themis argues(convincingly, in my
mind)that the myth of Dictaean Zeuus ant the Curetes, Dionysus,
Zagreus are myths underlying old intitiation rites. The youth is torn
to pieces symbolically by the titans, and reborn a full member of the
tribe.
Dionysus also was part of a story much like that of Dictaean Zeus or
Poseidon/Kronos/Telchines so I wonder if there isn't an indirect
connection to Apam Napat. And Hephaestus, as mentioned before, was at
the bottom of an ocean as well, raised by watery female figures there.
I know these associations are a little loose, but I see the themes of
second birth/intitiation in all of them, and they have a thread of
common characters that I think does point in a direction of a
connection.
Cort