Skiri Bastarnae

From: tgpedersen@...
Message: 9779
Date: 2001-09-25

If I choose to start the history, glottogenesis of the Germanic
languages with "Odin"'s departure from Tanais, there are some peoples
and events that are left out: The Skiri and Bastarnae, the arrival of
the Goths in Gothi(sk)skandza. This is what I can come up with:

Note that names of Skiri and Bastarnae are probably both adjectives,
cf the adjectives Eng. sheer, Germ. schier "pure", and from something
found also in Dutch verbasteren "to corrupt" with adjectival (in IE,
and even in Etruscan, should we want to refer back to IndoTyrrhenian)
suffix -n-. So they are the pure and impure what? It is as if a noun
were left out here. Could it be Goths? This would mean that we would
have to push Jordanes account of the arrival of the Goths back
several hundred years from the usually assumed 300 CE. Is that
possible? That would also make possible a war with Egypt which
Jordanes claimed took place.

But what language did the Goths speak then, if Germanic was first
spoken as a pidgin, later creole by the Bastarnae? Well, they sang
songs of Eterpamara, Hanala, Fritigern, Vidigoia. Their women had
names like Lampeto and Marpesia. Medopa, daughter of king Gudila.
Stalces, Gothic leader. Are these Germanic names?? Jordanes assures
us they are Gothic. Is this the 30% substrate language of Germanic?

Jordanes: The Origin and Deeds of the Goths XIV (79) Now the first of
these heroes, as they themselves relate in their legends, was Gapt,
who begat Hulmul. And Hulmul begat Augis; and Augis begat him who was
called Amal, from whom the name of the Amali comes. This Amal begat
Hisarnis. Hisarnis moreover begat Ostrogotha, and Ostrogotha begat
Hunuil, and Hunuil likewise begat Athal. Athal begat Achiulf and
Oduulf. Now Achiulf begat Ansila and Ediulf, Vultuulf and Hermanaric.
And Vultuulf begat Valaravans and Valaravans begat Vinitharius.
Vinitharius moreover begat Vandalarius; (80) Vandalarius begat
Thiudimer and Valamir and Vidimer; and Thiudimer begat Theodoric.
Theodoric begat Amalasuentha; Amalasuentha bore Athalaric and
Mathesuentha to her husband Eutharic, whose race was thus joined to
hers in kinship. (81) For the aforesaid Hermanaric, the son of
Achiulf, begat Hunimund, and Hunimund begat Thorismud. Now Thorismud
begat Beremud, Beremud begat Veteric, and Veteric likewise begat
Eutharic, who married Amalasuentha and begat Athalaric and
Mathesuentha. Athalaric died in the years of his childhood, and
Mathesuentha married Vitiges, to whom she bore no child.

You get a vague sense that the names are getting progressively more
Germanic. The first ones definitely aren't.

Torsten