Re: [tied] thou, you, you guys and all that stuff

From: fhb
Message: 8955
Date: 2001-09-02

--- Che <almogaver69@...> escribió: >

> Note as well that "usted/-es" is a modern invention,
> not much older than 150 years,

Not at all. "Usted" is documented in 1620 and "vuestra
merced" since the XVth century. Even in Catalan
"Vostè" is quite old.

so the traditional
> polite form is "vos", for both singular and plural,
> a confusing use that has recently driven the
> americans to a plenty of mixed solutions: "vos"
> sing. "ustedes" plural; "usted" sing "ustedes"
> plural; "vos"/"vosotros", etc. It's quite a
> complicated question, as there are different
> solutions depending on what country are we talking
> about as well as on the context.

No complication. I suggest you to read some basic
works on the subject, such as "Morfología histórica
del español" (Manuel Alvar - Bernard Pottier),
"Historia de la lengua española" (Rafael Lapesa),
"Manual de gramática histórica española" (R. Menéndez
Pidal) or even the "Gramàtica històrica catalana" (A.
M. Badia i Margarit). Most of your questions will be
answered in a satisfactory way.

And, of course, no Basque influence in Andalusian
dialect or in Spanish American. Most of the
characteristic features of Andalusian are due to
Asturian-Leonese, others to Mossarabic. Instead of it,
it is Northern Spanish who has a stronger Basque

And don't worry about your English. Mine is worse.

Francesc (from Barcelona as well).

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