Troy and Rasenna

From: Glen Gordon
Message: 8632
Date: 2001-08-20

My mind has been constantly rejecting the idea that the name
of the Etruscans (Rasenna) is derived from the name "Troy".

But...

It seems like the best idea for its origin so far and what's
worse is that my mind is slowly but surely being drawn more and
more to this possibility. It would require a Tyrrhenian term like
*tares-ena, meaning effectively "Troyans". The initial aspirate
stop *t- would disappear because of a strange rule I've detected
in Tyrrhenian whereupon, if the first vowel is *a, the
otherwise initial accent is placed on the _second_ syllable.
In this instance (as with others like *Xastor "Venus" > Turan
and *p:arowa > ruva "brother"), the accent is on the second
syllable and so *taresena > /rasna/ with the typically missing
initial consonant of yore.

What is the origin of this name, anyway? Is it Anatolian? What
does it mean?

Have I gone mad? (Yes, gLeNny you have) Who was that? (I'm your
conscience) Conscience? (Yes) Why, I think I *have* gone mad.
I'm talking to my conscience. (Bwahahaha) Well, so long. Time for
my medication. See yous all at the mental.

-------------------------------------------------
gLeNny gEe
...wEbDeVEr gOne bEsErK!

home: http://glen_gordon.tripod.com
email: glengordon01@...
-------------------------------------------------



>From: "Piotr Gasiorowski" <gpiotr@...>
>Reply-To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com
>To: <cybalist@yahoogroups.com>
>Subject: Re: [tied] Quandoque et bonus...
>Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 21:55:28 +0200
>
>I was being only half serious, but there are a few points worth making
>(sorry for the slip I made, BTW: Wilusa- is Luwian and Wilusija- is
>Hittite). First, the identification of Wilusa (*wi:l-us-) with Ilios/Ilion
>(i:lio- < *wi:l-ijo-) is quite unproblematic (cf. Message #4348) and
>supported by parallel formulaic collocations ("steep Wilusa/Ilios") in the
>Iliad and in a Luwian poem, and the Hittite reference to Alaksandus of
>Wilusija mentioned in Joseph's posting.
>
>As for Troy <tro:ia:, tro´┐Ża:>, in Homer's usage the term may stand for both
>the region of the Troad and for the city that was its capital, identified
>with Ilios. But if it could be argued that Taruisa = Troy, this would mean
>that Troy accidentally lent its name to Ilios -- a different city in the
>Troad, of central importance to the plot of the Iliad and therefore
>usurping the place of the regional capital in the imagination of the
>Greeks. The initial <ta-ru-> in <ta-ru-i-sa> may well be a representation
>of /tru-/ in Hittite orthography, and since there are variable
>correspondences involving i/e, u/o and e/a between late Luwian dialects and
>Greek, something like *tru-is- might plausibly underly the name of Troy
>(perhaps via *truis- ~ *trois-ija: > *troihija:).
>
>Piotr
>
>
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: cas111jd@...
>To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com
>Sent: Monday, August 20, 2001 3:44 PM
>Subject: Re: [tied] Quandoque et bonus...
>
>
>Actually, Homer may easily be interpretted as referring to Troia as a
>state or people, with the city definitely as Ilion. As the people
>there in classical times were Thracian-speaking Hellespontine
>Phrygians or Dardanians. The latter seems more accurate, especially
>given the Egyptian reference to the 'Drdn' vassals of the Hittites at
>Kadesh. Troas/Troia/the Troad was a regional appellation, IMO, which
>could have been the name of a league of city-states in the area.
>
>As for Taruisa, I doubt it was synonymous with Troy. I believe that
>it should, instead, be indentified with the classical city south of
>Sardis, found on classical maps variously as Tira and Tyrrha, which
>was in the region known as Torrhebis (Cayster valley east of
>Ephesos). This name is uncannily similar to that of the
>Tyrhennians/Etruscans.
>
>


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