Odp: [tied] Re: kuningas <-> knyaz

<Hals-> in the sense "narrow something" (strait, pass, etc.) is found in Germanic toponymy, but here I feel we have a personal name or anyway a term denoting a man, just as in other -ing derivatives. The Heimskringla says that the province of Helsingjaland (not to be confused with Helsinki) was established by Thorer Helsing (note also Hysing and Helsing, Gandalf's sons). <Helsing> has the typical structure of tribal or clan names.

Piotr

----- Original Message -----

From: tgpedersen@...

To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 12:13 PM

Subject: [tied] Re: kuningas <-> knyaz

--- In cybalist@..., "Piotr Gasiorowski" <gpiotr@...> wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: tgpedersen@... > > > And how old is the name Helsinge (obviously Germanic) then? > > I don't know for sure, but I think Scandinavian X-ing(e) is more or less the same formation as German X-ing(e) and English X-ing(s) (OE X- ingas), with the suffix added to a personal name and the placeneme referring to "people of X". My guess is *Hals-ing- "(village inhabited by) people of someone whose nickname was Hals)", but I may be wrong. This type of placename formation is archaic in Britain and in Germany, and presumably also in Scandinavia. From <hals> in the sense "throat" > "narrow strait" is what I've read.