This discussion reminds me of exchanges on
evolution between a molecular biologist and a paleoanthropologist: one can
only see simple cellular change, and the other only sees complex change in a
specific species :-).
Glen:
As I've elaborated, the colour signifance would be
primarily associated with the realms and the colours found within them:
Overworld (yellow, bright blue), Middleworld (green) and Underworld (red). These
also happened to be the colours of the three seasons: winter, spring/summer,
fall. Since the priests were associated with the Overworld, the
herder-cultivators with the Middleworld and the warriors with the Underworld,
the colour symbolism was then transferred to these three social functions as
well.
Modern language has a large group of color words used descriptively, the
subject languages used a much smaller group of words non-descriptively.
They were subgroups. Perhaps we have one group, the spectrum, and other
subgroups..but nobody uses "spectrum" as a descriptive adjective to better
express the color of a dress. As the groups were associated to seasons and
mythological realms analogously..color was (in my view, better) expressed
analogously. Greek priestesses of Artemis did not wear yellow robes, they
wore saffron robes. And the description loses something in
translation to yellow.
Mark Odegard:
PIE is imputed at best to have four color-terms, and
these need to be understood in terms different from ours.
Precisely.
Mark again:
>With garments, unless you have dyes, you have a
very limited choice of
> colors. The priest likely wore white wool or
white linen -- 'white' >here
>probably being on the dingy side.
Natural dyes tend to give you >browns and
>blacks. One ancient recipe
for red dye is to boil >European ivy sap in
>urine.
The urine did not have a color
function, but was used as a "mordant": its application was worked out to
the degree that the difference in result between male and female human urine and
various animal urines was known. It functioned to open the natural fiber
(or leather) and seal the color, and prevent "washing out" or
fading. Urine was also used late in the hand made Irish/Scots tartan
industry, and continued until late in the 19th century when replaced by aniline
dyes. Other natural mordents used by the Scots included alum, iron,
copper, fir-club moss and oak-galls.
Mark again:
> Undoubtedly, of course, they could say something
like 'light like new
> grass', 'dark like pine needles' or 'light like a
clear cloudless sky
> after a rainstorm'. But these are not real
color-words.
But neither were the small group of terms we identify "real color words" in
the sense that we currently use "real color words". By deliberate
selection of analogous color terms, and modifying with other adjectives (as in
your examples above) ..the color could be more precisely and descriptively
pinned, and other communication could also be expressed in the choice of
analogy. "Mordant" has another meaning as an adjective: harshly ironic or
sinister. In describing the embarkation of victorious heroes after ten years of
absence, to return home to lost kingdoms and strangers, unfaithful wives,
unknown children and a changed world..in which their own value would be
questioned.....Homer said much more than color by the very meaningful use
of: "a wine dark sea" .
La Revedere;
Rex H. McTyeire
Bucharest,
Romania
<rexbo@...>