Re: Substrates in Latin and Germanic

From: guestu5er
Message: 68737
Date: 2012-03-03

>At least with the classical interpretation paganus doesn't
>belong here, since it is supposed to be a loan from Latin
>paganus "villager", itself derived from 'pagus' "district".

Of course.

>I will interpret your puzzlement as caused by the possibilty
>hinted at here that "sin" is a pre-Christian concept in
>Eastern Europe.

Ahem. (Not only in Eastern Europe. Ireland, North and South
America aren't Eastern Europe. :))

>The long dispute here over whether peccatum "sin" was borrowed
>from Latin into Celtic might be relevant here

"...ora pro nobis, peccatoribus, since Torsten doesn't know quod
he's talkin' about" :-)

>since it it weren't, "sin" would also be pre-Christan in Western

Wait a minute! Don't you thing that pre-Christian religions didn't
know what <sin> was!

>I am reminded of a phenomenon called here a 'dumme-bøde', "stupid-
>fine", a 'fine' biker gangs hit people with who they deemed did
>something stupid and which accumulates interest rapidly.

Wat'n dat?! Rocker, die Unschuldige verkloppen?

>It would be a practical tool for slavers in procuring slaves.

Your slave idea might, after all, have some relevance. Do you
imply that Thracian and Dacian slaves played a major role in
the business?

>There might be a connection with shepherds; I haven't found it yet.

Well, until we get other insights, the one "link" might be that
"Sarmatian"-Prototurkic one of the "Chabans" (Cholpans), you
know, those Turkic-Iranic "Schöffe/Suffet", kinda noble upper
crust, with judiciary preogatives.

Cf. the Petcheneg tribe "Chopon" led by Giazis (Yazi), mentioned
by emperor Constantine VII Porphyrogenitus in "De administrando