Re: Tudrus

From: t0lgsoo1
Message: 67084
Date: 2011-01-11

>***R Speaking of a more notorious hater, I read that Hitler's name
>was derived from Czech Hidlar, Hidlarc^ek --what does that mean in
>Czech? My Slavic friends, who speak Polish, Slovenian, Serbian,
>Ukrainian and Russian can't make heads or tails of it

In German, his name is actually a misspelling. The correct
one is Hüttler. From Hütte "hut". The name, in the case of
some of his relatives, was also spelled Hiedler (another
misspelling).

Regarding this kind of peasant 2nd names connected with Hütte,
Hans Bahlow ('Deutsches Namenlexikon', Suhrkamp-Taschenbuch 65,
2nd edition, 1976) has these explanations:

"Hütter (oberdeutsch): nach der Wohn- oder Arbeitstätte
in einer Hütte (e.g. Erzhütte, Schmelzhütte, Holzhauer-
hütte, Almhütte u. ä.); vergleiche Erdhütter, Seehütter,
Siebenhütter. Ähnlich *Hüttler* ([this means] im bayerischen
Schwaben = Zimmermann)."

So Hitler can also mean Zimmermann, Zimmerer (carpenter).

The additional information that Hüttler has the (dialectal)
variant Hittler is "hidden" in another entry a dozen of
lines below the entry I quoted above.

"Hüttmann, Hüttemann (Hamburg, Kiel): vergleiche Hinrik
Kordes oder H. Hüttemann, Pächter der Glashütte in
Hawechorst. Auch Hütten, von der Hütten. Viele Ortsnamen
Hütten -- Hüttner (oberdeutsch): zu Ortsname/n und
österreich. Name/n Hütten (zu der Hütten" [here another
example of die Hütte in Bavarian die Hütt(e)n as a singular!]),
entrundet (Österreichis) Hittner, wie Hüttler: Hittler."

There is another entry, on another page, that reads:

"Hiß, Hieß siehe Heiß! -" [followed by] Hitler (Österreich)
siehe Hiedler (mit Vorbehalt)! Vergleiche Hüttler (wie
Hüttner, Hittner)."

So Hitler also contains the ü > i transformation which
is typical of various German dialects, but especially
of those in the South and East. (For the same reason
the alternative spelling Hiedler for some uncle or grand-
father of his.)

BTW, these entries might also be interesting (even relevant?):

"Hi(t)schke, Hitzschke, Hitzke (Sachsen, Sudeten),
bisher ungedeutet" [!!], "kann nur Koseformen zu
slaw.-tschech. Hinco, Hinek, Hincek = Heinrich sein"
[cf. German Hinz & Heinz], "analog zu Nitschke,
Mitschke = Nikolaus; mit -old erweitert: Hietschold
(wie Nietschold, Kitschold = Christian, Hetzschold,
Heintschold, Petzold). Patronym. Hi(t)scher (wie Mitscher).
Vergleiche Bened. Hitzscholt v. Pegau/Sachsen 1503,
Thomas Hitzsch 1544 Sachsen."

"Hitz, Hitzel, Hitzler (Bayern): Hicz, Hiczlo pistor
1368 Mies/Böhmen, Nicl. Hiczel 1402 B.-Kamnitz."

"Hitziger (oberdeutsch) neben Hitzinger ist alemannische
Besonderheit, wie Bessiger, Fruttiger, Schmutziger u. ä."

So Hitz- and Hitsch- reflexes are also concentrated
in the Oberdeutsch areas as well as the neighboring
Bohemia + its neighbor Saxonia.

(NB: Hindenburg talked contemptuously of a "Bohemian
corporal" (böhmischer Gefreiter) because of a
toponymical confusion: Hindenburg thought "Hüttler"
had been born in Braunau in Eastern Bohemia,
whereas Hitler's Braunau is another town, at
the Austrian-Bavarian border, by the river Inn,
a few km East of the birthplace of the current Pope.)

George