Re: 'dyeus'

From: t0lgsoo1
Message: 66524
Date: 2010-09-04

>You mean to ask 'Why "minus Romanian?"?'.
>The question mark was there because I didn't have enough data on
>Romanian.

So, you mean those i & d transformations, not the fact that Rumanian
is also some kind of confersion of "latina vulgata".

>The only thing I could remember was judeţ "county" (vel sim.).

Indeed; along with jude and judecätor "judge". (The primeval
meaning of the word judetz [Zu-detz] is "judgment" in the sense of
iurisprudentia, i.e. "trial, lawsuit". The semantic extension to
"county" was because of the fact that the see of such judges was
in the main locality of such a county. (Moreover, in Transylvania,
the neighboring Hungarians as well as the German-speaking
Transylvanian Saxons, called their counties "sees" (szék & Stuhl).
This fact only enhanced the idea of judetz.)

NB: in the entire Romanian subdialect spoken in the former
principality of Moldova (today's Republic Moldova is only the Eastern
part of it; the same is valid for Northern Bucovina which belongs
to Ukraine), these words are pronounced with [dZ] (or d3 if you
prefer): giude, giudecatä (giudicatä), giudecätor(iu) (giudicätor(iu)),
giudetz. Further such words: gios instead of jos "down" (compare
with Italian giù), gioc instead of joc "play; game; dance" (and
gioacä <-> joacä "play, game", giucärie <-> jucärie "Spielzeug",
giucätor <-> jucätor "player". Giura, giurare, giurämânt <-> jura,
jurare, jurämânt < Lat. iurare "oath" etc. (along with jurat "juror" in
a court, and juriu "jury").

Yet [dZ] instead of [Z] is not used in all words. OTOH, there is
another phenomenon, where [dZ] becomes [Z]; this one is typical of
all Rumanian subdialects spoken in Banat, Transylvania and Moldova;
e.g. plânje, jer, Jermania, sânje, jeneral etc. instead of plânge, ger,
Germania, sânge, general ("weeps, frost, Germany, blood,
general/ly"), the latter also representing the standard received
pronunciation. (In the Rumanian subdialects of Transylvania and
Banat, there is no [dZ]; only [Z]; the pronunciation [dZ] is "imported"
from the standard language; further e.g. jenunchi/jenuntzi and
Eujen instead of genunchi "knee" and Eugen "Eugene".)

A strange occurrence in the numerous variants of George/Gheorghe:
George [dZordZe], Giurgiu [dZurdZu], Jurj [ZurZ], but also... Iuga
['yuga], Iorga/Iorgu and Iorda(n). I suppose the latter are influenced
by Greek Yorgos & the like. (But this one is actually not quite linked
to Lat. (d)y<vowel>.)

>But on the other hand Ion vs. Giovanni and Jean.

Yes. (Ion & Ioan, which is the older variant and closer to Ioannes.)
Also Iisus (influenced by Greek) and Isus (never *Iesus or *Gesus or
*Jesus). For Ianuarie ("January"), there is the old Gerar (Jerar), but
I doubt that it is a derivation of Ianuarius (so not a real equivalence
to Ital. Gennaro); it is rather a reflex of ger (jer) "frost; ice" (< Lat.
gel--, with the rhotacization of the L), although one might be
reminded by another rhotacization, that one of the N (e.g. instead of
the standard inima "the heart", irima/irema).

Also with [Z] jneapän (Iuniperus nana; Pinus pumilio; Pinus mughus);
and perhaps jep (Pinus mugo) (cf. Ital. ginebro) coexisting with [j]
synonyms: ienupär [yenup&r] and ienuper. (Wacholder = South-
German Kranawitt/Kronawitt)

Jug [Zug] "yoke", but iugär [yug&r] (seldom jugär) = 0,5775 ha
< Lat. iugerum. (I assume that this one might by medieval, from
Middle Latin. In German, it is assimilated with the word Joch.)
So, the derivation such as înjugare, conjugare, conjunctiv,
conjunctzie, subjugare are pronounced [Z], never *îniugare,
*coniugare, *coniunctiv, *coniunctzie, *subiugare.

(As for dyeus, the Rumanian reflexes are dzeu, dzäu, zeu, zäu
as well as dzi, zi, dziuä, ziuä, dzîuä, zîuä and zuä "day" and fig.
"daylight". Plurals: dzile, zile, dzîle, zîle. In contrast with joi [Zoy]
"Thursday" < Lat. dies Iovis.)

George