From: Torsten
Message: 65476
Date: 2009-11-28
>I'll take your word for it.
> --- On Sat, 11/28/09, Torsten <tgpedersen@...> wrote:
> --- In cybalist@... s.com, Rick McCallister <gabaroo6958@ ...> wrote:
> > Ahh, maybe I should have tried to related it to *sen- "old,
> > elder, alderman, senator" as in the notion that age makes us
> > wiser, able to "judge"
>
> More likely the oppposite direction "judge, senator, elder" ->
> "old".
>
> Actually I think I found the sense "old" also outside of IE, in one
> of the sources I used, but I can't find it now.
> >
> > --- On Thu, 11/26/09, Rick McCallister <gabaroo6958@ ...> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Yes, I posted that on the web about 12 years ago and although I've lost my Etruscan notes, I realize, as Glen Gordon said, this really is an "anti-dictionary" in that I put in everything I could find, to let the more knowledgeable figure it out. My thoughts were that the original root was similar in meaning to Arabic Haram "forbidden, sanctuary" ÃÂ e.g. al-aHram "the Pyramids of Gizeh", etc,ÃÂ
>
> > --- On Thu, 11/26/09, Torsten <tgpedersen@ hotmail. com> wrote:
>
> That az96 guy is *very* creative.
> Zavaroni --not afraid to go out on a limb from time to time, but
> he's very patient, Â not dogmatic at all
> > From: Torsten <tgpedersen@ hotmail. com>Burrows seems to agree on that:
>
> > http://etruscans1.tripod.com/Language/EtruscanSA.html
> > sac-, Sac-, sac-a, sac-ri
> > "carrying out a sacred act, to consecrate"
> > [g/lb83, mp68, dep, pa]
> > sacni "priest" [g/lb83 77]
> > "consecration" [mp68: 263]
> > Sacni "to cover" [az96]
> > sacni, sacniu, Sacni-cn, Sacni-tn,
> > Sacni-cla, Sacni-tle, Sacni-cl-eri, Sacni-cS-treS
> > "sacred place, sanctuary, consecrated" [mp68, pa, dep, gzb]
> > Sacnic "cover" [az96]
> > Sacnic cilth "sanctuary" [mp68: 263]
> > Sacnic cith
> > "tegimen apex, pointed hood for fulguriator and haruspex" [az96]
> > sacnicleri "for the temple" [gm97]
> > sacnisa, SacniSa, Sacnisa "consecrate, dedicate"
> > [am91, g/lb83, 85: 161, mc91: 135, mp68: 263]
> > "covered" > "buried" [az96]
> > sacnitalte, sacnisa, sacniSa "to consecrate" [mp68]
> > Sacnitle "covers (plural)" [az96]
> > sacniu, sacniv "(has) covered" [az96]
> > suc-, Suc-, Suc-i, Suc-ivn, Suc-ri "ritual act" [mp68]
> > see Latin sacer "sacred, holy"
> > [az96, g/lb83, 85: 161, mc91: 135, mp68: 263, gzb, dep, pa]
> > see Greek hagios "holy" [dep]
> > see Oscan sakoro "sacred" [dep]
> > see Hittite saklai "custom" [dep]
> > see Indo-European *sak- "to consecrate" [pa]
> > < *steg-n- [az96]
>
> > Couldn't match better
>
> I wonder if it went like this
> Donor language *san,-
> Loaned into PPIE as *san,n-
> -> *sakn-
> -> PIE *sakr, *sakn- (ie. heteroclitic)
>
> cf. Pokorny:
> es-r.(gW), Gen. es-n-és "Blut"; alter r/n-Stamm.
>
> Ai. ásr.k, ásr.t, Gen. asnáh. "Blut", asr.ja: RV. 3, 8, 4,
> nachved. asra- n. ds.;
>
> arm. ariun "Blut" (*esr.-);
>
> gr. poet. éar, ei~ar (e:~ar Hes.) "Blut"
> (wohl urgr. *e:~ar mit ders. Dehnstufe wie he:~par;
> s. Schulze Qu. ep. 165f.);
>
> alat. aser (asser), assyr "Blut",
> assara:tum "Trank aus Wein und Blut gemischt"
> (wohl aser mit einfachem s; vgl. WH. I 72);
>
> lett. asins "Blut" (*esen-?), Pl. asinis;
> vgl. dazu Trautmann Bsl. Wb. 14,
> Mühlenbach-Endzelin Lett.-D. Wb. I 143;
>
> toch. A ysa:r-
>
> hitt. e-es^-har (eshar), Gen. eshanas.
> WP. I 162, WH. I 72, 849, Meillet Esquisse2 39'
>
> which is possibly the same word.