Re: Dumezil

From: Rick McCallister
Message: 60839
Date: 2008-10-12

--- On Sun, 10/12/08, Francesco Brighenti <frabrig@...> wrote:

> From: Francesco Brighenti <frabrig@...>
> Subject: [tied] Re: Dumezil
> To: cybalist@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Sunday, October 12, 2008, 7:51 AM
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "kishore patnaik"
>
> <kishorepatnaik09@...> wrote:
>
> > Gort et al (2007) insist Varuna is connected to Greek
> Ouranos...
> > Anthony(2008)in his latest book does not deny that
> there is no
> > connection between Varuna and Ouranos but he says we
> can not
> > disprove the disconnection either -- good logic to
> insist
> > connection, where there is none!
>
> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/56535
> "Attempts to link Ouranos to Varuna etymologically
> have been
> generally abandoned. "The Greek Ouranos is the
> Sanskrit Varuna"
> is no longer as undisputed as it was in Dumézil's time
> -- compare
> Frisk's Greek and Mayrhofer's Sanskrit etymological
> dictionaries.
> From a PIE perspective, Gk. Ouranos may well be related to
> *werseti 'rains' (Puhvel, e.g., postulates Ouranos
> < *worsanos), but
> Skt. Varuna probably isn't. As for Varuna, many
> Vedicists are now
> inclined to consider a PIE root *ver- 'to speak, to
> speak solemnly,
> to speak with truth' (< PIE *u_erh1-). The name
> Varuna would, thus,
> be etymologically related to the Vedic term vrata-
> 'solemn promise,
> oath' or also, according to others, 'law,
> contract' (cf. Avestan
> urvata-), as well as to Latin verus 'true', Greek
> ereo 'I shall
> speak' etc. This etymology would make Varuna a god of
> true-speech,
> i.e. of spoken truth, stressing his role as Vedic arbiter
> of ethical
> behavior, namely, as the god of oaths."
>
> Regards,
> Francesco

"Speech" and "rule" are bound together is lots of societies e.g. in Mesoamerica where Nahuatl Tlatoani and Mangue Mankimi both mean "speaker and ruler", also European Dictator "Speaker" and "Ruler."